View source for Property talk:P1683

{{Property documentation
|description            = {{TranslateThis
  | en = quote supporting the statement claim (to be used in the "sources" field).
  }}
|domain                 = references
|source                 = external reference, Wikipedia list article (either infobox or source)
|example                = :*{{Q|25279}} ''{{P|37}}'' {{q|33856}}
:::::::: source: {{P|50}} => {{q|585592}}
:::::::::::{{P|1683}} => "De officiële talen zijn het Engels, het Nederlands en het Papiamentu.", in Dutch
}}

{{ExternalUse|
* [[:ca:Plantilla:Infotaula personatge]]
* [[:ga:Teimpléad:WD Bosca Sonraí Carachtar]]
}}
{{Reference properties}}


== allowed values? ==

the previous "quote" [[Property_talk:P387|property (P387)]] had as its allowed values the following: "long text string (typically > 15 characters, no longer than 200)"

will a similar limit be applied to this new property? Just wondering as I update the [[Wikidata:Verifiability]] page section on copyright and fair use: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Verifiability#Verifiability_and_copyright

thanks. -[[User:Thepwnco|Thepwnco]] ([[User talk:Thepwnco|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:07, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

== Altering a quote? ==

Is it okay to slightly alter a quote to make the context more clear, indicating the changes with brackets? For example, I would like to add a reference to the statement

{{C|51727|802|51736}}

The relevant dialogue from {{Q|181069}}, chapter 36, is:

<blockquote>
Obi-Wan Kenobi: Qui-Gon Jinn would never join you.

Count Dooku: Don’t be so sure, my young Jedi. You forget that he was once my apprentice, just as you were once his.
</blockquote>

I would use the following quote as a reference:

{{St||1683|You forget that [Qui-Gon Jinn] was once my apprentice}}

Is that okay? —[[User:DSGalaktos|DSGalaktos]] ([[User talk:DSGalaktos|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:50, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

:As you cut the end of the sentence, I'd add "[..]" at the end and where you removed "he". --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 12:04, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
::Agreed on the end, but isn’t the ellipsis at “he” implied by the “[Qui-Gon Jinn]”? —[[User:DSGalaktos|DSGalaktos]] ([[User talk:DSGalaktos|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:08, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
:::Or perhaps it should be {{St||1683|You forget that he [Qui-Gon Jinn] was once my [Count Dooku’s] apprentice […].}} ? —[[User:DSGalaktos|DSGalaktos]] ([[User talk:DSGalaktos|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:12, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
::::Looks good, but apparently it's "..." not "[..]" (see [[w:Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style#Ellipses|enwiki]]). --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 12:22, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
:::::[[w:de:Auslassungspunkte#Auslassungen_in_Zitaten|dewiki]] uses brackets, and ain’t afraid of no beautiful Unicode ellipses (... vs …). So which do we follow on multi-language Wikidata? [[Help:Sources]] is unfortunately quiet on this… —[[User:DSGalaktos|DSGalaktos]] ([[User talk:DSGalaktos|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:29, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
::::::If there is one, I think one should follow the conventions of the language the text is in. In doubt, I'd opt for ASCII ;) --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 12:55, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
{{Outdent|::::::}}
# Is that a convention of the English ''language'', or just of the English Wikipedia?
# Since most of the languages Wikidata supports can’t be fully represented in ASCII, I think it would be wrong to restrict ourselves to ASCII for any reason – any client that can’t handle Unicode isn’t suitable for Wikidata usage in the first place. —[[User:DSGalaktos|DSGalaktos]] ([[User talk:DSGalaktos|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:05, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

To resolve this discussion, I propose the following guideline:
'''When handling quotes in a certain language, follow the quoting guidelines of that language’s Wikipedia.'''
For example, in English one would follow [[:en:Wikipedia:Quotations]], specifically the [[:en:Wikipedia:Quotations#Formatting|Formatting]] section: mark additions or replacements with [square brackets], and removed text with an ellipsis ... (three unspaced periods).
In German, the guideline is [[:de:Wikipedia:Zitate]]: square brackets, and Unicode ellipsis “…”.
Rationale: the guidelines of a certain Wikipedia are less ambiguous than the guidelines of the language (according to which style guide? I’m sure there are lots of different quotation styles for any given language), and likely to be reasonable.
Any opposed? WDYT [[User:Jura1|Jura]]? —[[User:Galaktos|Galaktos]] ([[User talk:Galaktos|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:29, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

== Use as qualifier? ==

When this property was proposed, it was to add qoutes to references. Last year [[User:Jura1|Jura1]] in [[special:diff/716386121]] added "as qualifier" to the property constraints. Why that? I cannot see how it can used other than to quote from a source. There is no examples of use as qualifier, and no prior discussion that I know of. --[[User:Dipsacus fullonum|Dipsacus fullonum]] ([[User talk:Dipsacus fullonum|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:28, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

: {{reply to|Dipsacus fullonum}} by far the most common property where {{P|P1683}} is used as qualifier seems to be {{P|P5323}} ([https://w.wiki/6ZJ Query]) – I feel like those should use {{P|P1932}} instead, though. —[[User:Galaktos|Galaktos]] ([[User talk:Galaktos|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:40, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

* See [[Lexeme:L24601]] for such a use. I don't think P1932 could work there. Is it creating problems somewhere? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 11:27, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

== Quotation marks ==

Are we supposed to add in the quotation marks to the quote ourselves, or are they already implied by the property? --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:54, 9 March 2020 (UTC)

: {{reply to|Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )}} implied, I’d say. (Technical argument: you can format quotations in HTML as <nowiki><q>quote</q></nowiki> → <q>quote</q>, which automatically adds quotes, so you wouldn’t want explicit quotes in the text.) --[[User:Galaktos|Galaktos]] ([[User talk:Galaktos|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:54, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

== Internal quotation marks ==

[[en:Moldovan language]] imports a quotation from Wikidata (under "IETF language tag" at [[Q36392]]) and puts it in double quotation marks, per that wiki's MOS. Unfortunately the quotation in question includes double quotation marks, resulting in nested quotation marks in a manner contrary to the MOS (internal quotation marks should be single). How should this situation be dealt with? Should we assume here that any use is going to be put in quotation marks, and change appropriately to single quotation marks? Is there a module that can change them automatically? Or must we just endure the inconsistency? [[User:Hairy Dude|Hairy Dude]] ([[User talk:Hairy Dude|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:57, 8 February 2021 (UTC)

: I would assume English Wikipedia’s citation module should change the internal double quotes to single ones. We can hardly anticipate each Wikipedia’s style guide here. —[[User:Galaktos|Galaktos]] ([[User talk:Galaktos|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:39, 25 February 2021 (UTC)

== Quoting a websites' source code ==

{{ping|Shlomo|Neo-Jay|Filceolaire|DixonD|Laddo}}

I would like to use parts of the source code of a website in a reference statement. [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q4115189&type=revision&diff=1713795521&oldid=1713795311 like here]. Should I use this property for it? Should I propose a dedicated property? Should I do it at all? Thanks for your input –[[User:Shisma|Shisma]] ([[User talk:Shisma|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:30, 26 August 2022 (UTC)
: {{ping|Shisma}} {{P|1683}} is typically meant to highlight a small portion of the referenced source that specifically supports a statement.  I would add that it is expected to be readable.  Not knowing the context in which you plan to use it, pretty hard to tell if it's appropriate...   '' [[User:Laddo|Lαδδo]]''  [[User_talk:Laddo|''<small>chat </small>'';)]] 11:02, 29 August 2022 (UTC)