Talk:Joe Lycett

Joe Lycett's obsessions

I did not see reference in this article to a programme he has presented on BBC Radio 4 called "Joe Lycett's Obsessions". Vorbee (talk) 18:39, 8 January 2020 (UTC)

Mr Hugo Boss

This article is going to have to be renamed Hugo Boss (British Comedian) at some point, depending on which identity Boss continues to use. OhNoOhDear (talk) 17:18, 1 March 2020 (UTC)

I would hold of on a Page Move (Possibly to "Hugo Boss (comedian)") until the relevant show has aired. The 'deed poll' posted on Twitter has important parts redacted which arguably makes it an unreliable source. The only visible signature is the one under his 'new' name, which does not a complete deed poll make. Furthermore, I would propose semi-protecting this article for a week as there is some edit warring occurring over this issue. rdm_box 17:29, 1 March 2020 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rdmbox (talk • contribs)

Not convinced this should have been moved so soon. Seems unlikely he will keep using the new name once the relevant show has aired, and sources—e.g. [1], [2], seem to keep (at least in part) calling him by his old name. This includes his official website [3]. Would support moving back. YorkshireLad (talk) 22:04, 1 March 2020 (UTC)

Is it Wikipedia policy to play up to a stunt like this? I quite like Lycett's approach and his humour in general, but is it really for Wikipedia to be used in such a blatant publicity stunt? Media sources are already using this page move in their reports [4]. Are there other examples of Wikipedia being used in this way? Poltair (talk) 22:40, 1 March 2020 (UTC)

Yes, as the truth of the matter is that he has changed his name, so Wikipedia must report the truth. Will d601 (talk) 10:23, 14 April 2020 (UTC)

• Even if the deed poll is real surely Joe Lycett should still be the article name re:common name. All articles state Joe Lycett has changed is name to Hugo Boss, and his twitter tag is still his previous name. | "When the subject of a biographical article self-publishes a new name, both the article titling and biographies of living persons policies apply. Particularly relevant: WP:Biographies of living persons § Using the subject as a self-published source WP:Article titles § Name changes, advising to give more weight to reliable sources published after the name change when deciding whether the article title should change.The determination of how much extra weight should be given to more recent sources is guided by the likelihood the new name is going to stick Ryanharmany (talk) 23:33, 1 March 2020 (UTC)

I literally came back to chime in and say per WP:COMMONNAME this shouldn’t be changed just yet. Of all the things to return to enwiki for. Patient Zero^talk 06:24, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

A lot of Wikipedia articles are written in a stage name, or a commonly used name. The name that he is more likely to be known as should be used (Joe Lycett) but we should still make sure that his real name is still cited as Hugo Boss, although we probably won't know when he actually changes his name back (if he actually does), so we need to keep our ears and eyes open for that Will d601 (talk) 10:23, 14 April 2020 (UTC)

• Concerned by 1) potential vandalism in regards to the linking of the incorrect Hugo Boss (Comedian) over Hugo Boss (Fashion Designer) to the founder tag in the company page. Also, arguably the signature is not phallic per se. More like a toe or finger, with a distinguished "nail" covering only the upper right portion of the U. No official word on that yet. ^{Anonymous editor} 08:40, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

  Also not something I’d ever imagine myself saying on here, either, but that is totally the head of a penis. Also, I’m pretty certain your signature violates WP:SIG as you have no link to your talk page? Patient Zero^talk 00:49, 6 March 2020 (UTC)

Requested move 1 March 2020

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: procedural close, reverting to stable title per WP:RMUM. If you would like to propose a different title, start by opening a new move discussion in a new section rather than re-moving the page after it has been reverted. It would be best to include evidence of how the proposed title would adhere to WP:COMMONNAME and WP:NAMECHANGES. Dekimasuよ! 03:44, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

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Hugo Boss (comedian) → Joe Lycett – reversion to common name, avoiding edit war with Thedamneditor who has already reverted a reversion Ryanharmany (talk) 23:40, 1 March 2020 (UTC)

• Support per WP:SPNC. The new name is a stunt to promote a TV show. There is no evidence that it is likely to become the common name ajmint (talk•edits) 00:20, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

• Oppose. The comedian has legally changed his name and has himself acknowledged that he has relinquished for all purposes his old name. This is sufficient evidence that it is likely to become the common name. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thedamneditor (talk • contribs) 00:55, 2 March 2020 (UTC)
• Support the change. The moving the page to to 'Hugo Boss' right now is much too soon. 'Joe Lycett' is WP:COMMONNAME for now. --92.239.179.144 (talk) 02:40, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Name, lead, etc

How should the lead be presented following on from his name change? I've no experience in this area, but find this recent news story interesting. Should it be:

1. Joe Harry Lycett (born 5 July 1988), <short bio>. In March 2020, Lycett changed his legal name to Hugo Boss.
2. Hugo Boss (born Joe Harry Lycett; 5 July 1988) <rest of bio...>

Are there any other precedents? Thanks. Lugnuts ^{Fire Walk with Me} 14:02, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

I would go for a compromise:

3: Joe Harry Lycett (born 5 July 1988; current legal name Hugo Boss) <rest of bio...>

as is is normal practice to write leads roughly in the form "bold name, bold other names and dates, short bio." I imagine he'll change the name back after a month or so at which point the lead can go back to normal. User:GKFX^talk 17:49, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

This is being over-thought.

Hugo Boss is his legal name now, wikipedia is **NOT here to speculate** as to whether he will change his name back.

Joe Lycett should redirect to his renamed article titled Hugo Boss.

Aeonx (talk) 19:14, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

• Pending some indication that he is changing his name back, let's leave it like this. --The Huhsz (talk) 19:19, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

If we look at other pages ;

• Sir Elton Hercules John CH CBE (born Reginald Kenneth Dwight; 25 March 1947[1])
• Marilyn Monroe (/ˈmærɪlɪn mənˈroʊ/; born Norma Jeane Mortenson; June 1, 1926 – August 4, 1962)[1]

Its shown as: official name (birth name, date of birth, date of death)

The page name follows WP:COMMONNAME not birth name nor official name. Ryanharmany (talk) 21:20, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

Exactly; people are not going to start referring to Lycett as Boss seriously unless the name sticks with him for some time, so the "common" name remains Lycett. Strictly speaking, WP:COMMONNAME applies only to the page title and not to the body text, but it seems odd to name the page "Joe Lycett" based on policy, then pick a different name for the article body based purely on a publicity stunt. I also think that WP:PROPORTION applies perfectly here:

An article should not give undue weight to minor aspects of its subject, but should strive to treat each aspect with a weight proportional to its treatment in the body of reliable, published material on the subject. For example, discussion of isolated events, criticisms, or news reports about a subject may be verifiable and impartial, but still disproportionate to their overall significance to the article topic. This is a concern especially in relation to recent events that may be in the news.

It's reasonably likely that the name will get formally changed back after the TV show has aired, and almost certain that Lycett's commonly-used name will not become Hugo Boss in the long run. As such, making prominent changes throughout the article based on a single stunt seems unreasonable. Only if the name were to persist for a while would it be appropriate to rename the article and switch to Boss thoughout. To address the "speculation" raised by Aeonx: Wikipedia has to make a decision one way or another (or fudge it with "Lycett/Boss") and this inevitably means making a subjective judgement about the significance of the name change. User:GKFX^talk 22:30, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

If his name gets changed back again, it's fairly easy to change the article to reflect this. If his name is legally Hugo Boss, I think the article should call him that. You've mentioned that this is a "publicity stunt"; are there reliable sources that say this, or indicate the name change is a temporary one? Or is this just your opinion? Comparing with other Wikipedia articles can be an unhelpful way to decide; our article on Cat Stevens might be an interesting comparison. --The Huhsz (talk) 22:54, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

There is a strong indication that Hugo Boss will continue to be his odficial name, both now andnin the future. I think it is wrong for WP to speculate that he will change it back, especially without any tangible evidence to indicate he will. Hugo Boss (comedian) should be the answer here. Aeonx (talk) 09:30, 6 March 2020 (UTC)

Whatever the official name is has NO impact on the page title.

Official English names are candidates for what to call an article, because somebody presumably uses them. They should always be considered as possibilities, but should be used only if they are actually the name most commonly used. Where an official name has changed we do give extra weight to secondary sources published after the change . But this applies only to secondary sources, not to primary sources such as journal articles that simply repeat a press release announcing a name change.-(Wikipedia:Official_names) Although official, scientific, birth, original, or trademarked names are often used for article titles, the term or name most typically used in reliable sources is generally preferred. Other encyclopedias are among the sources that may be helpful in deciding what titles are in an encyclopedic register, as well as what names are most frequently used. - (Wikipedia:Article_titles#Use_commonly_recognizable_names)Ryanharmany (talk) 18:10, 6 March 2020 (UTC)

Hmm. We aren't really discussing the page title, more the name, and how the lead handles it. The heading of the section indicates that. If there are good sources indicating that he intends to change his name back again, this is the time and place to bring them. There are plenty of good, non-primary sources meantime indicating he has officially changed his name, so we should go with those. Seems pretty obvious really. --The Huhsz (talk) 11:02, 7 March 2020 (UTC)

Going by the first comment by Aeonx "Joe Lycett should redirect to his renamed article titled Hugo Boss." and the fact that the comment I was replying to he says that it should be Hugo Boss (Comedian), I believe he is still talking about page name. I have already given my position on the page content. To reiterate, content naming him within the page should be Hugo Boss/Boss - as with other people who have changed their names. But page title should be as is. Ryanharmany (talk) 22:19, 7 March 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 19 June 2020

Change name to Hugo Boss as is his legal name 2A00:23C6:7794:C001:457B:EE44:3155:4025 (talk) 22:49, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

 Not done: please see the last paragraph in the Career section, which covers his name change and the fact that he changed it back to Joe Lycett in April of this year. Pupsterlove02 talk • contribs 23:01, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

shouldn't it say formerly known as Hugo boss after his name

he was legally called that so it should be mentioned a bit more prominently — Preceding unsigned comment added by Walk the dank (talk • contribs) 14:35, 23 July 2020 (UTC)

I've mentioned this in the Introduction, and bolded it for the redirect(s); that should cover it. I've also changed the category default: there is no logic in having a default different to the article name. Swanny18 (talk) 22:49, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Related to Edward Lycett?

I wonder if he might be related to an Edward Lycett, also of Birmingham, who founded a company making saddles for bicycles and motorbicycles? Middle More Rider (talk) 23:50, 14 September 2021 (UTC)

Given Birmingham is a city with more than a million inhabitants (and would've been close if not over that when said company was created) it is unlikely (also given that at the time people from all over the UK and world would set up their businesses in Birmingham when it came to manufacturing). Lycett is also a moderately common surname. 188.31.53.190 (talk) 17:20, 17 September 2021 (UTC)

Donkey

>In June 2022, a member of the audience at a Belfast show called the Police Service of Northern Ireland to complain about a joke that referenced a donkey.

Having seen the show, I can confirm that the joke in question does not reference a donkey. The reason the source wrongly claims it does seems to be a case of "Chinese whispers" stemming from the use of the phrase "Donkey dick", by Joe Lycett himself, but that simply means a large phallus, not literally an actual donkey. However, I recognise this is original research, so I'm bringing it up on the talk page before editing anything. StrexcorpEmployee (talk) 23:13, 23 June 2022 (UTC)

How does "donkey dick" not reference a donkey? There was never any suggestion that anyone was referring to "an actual donkey" (or an actual dick). (How very odd that someone would be offended by that phrase above all his other material. Anyway, it makes a great story.) Shantavira|^{feed me} 10:19, 4 September 2023 (UTC)