Altair110

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Hello, Altair110, and Welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions to this free encyclopedia. If you decide that you need help, check out Getting Help below, ask at the help desk, or place {{Help me}} on your talk page and ask your question there. Please remember to sign your name on talk pages by clicking or by typing four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your username and the date. Also, please do your best to always fill in the edit summary field. Below are some useful links to help you get started. Happy editing! CommanderWaterford (talk) 08:02, 5 July 2020 (UTC) Getting started Introduction Contributing to Wikipedia The five pillars of Wikipedia How to edit a page Intuitive guide to Wikipedia Finding your way around Table of contents Directories and indexes Department directory Editing articles How to develop an article Simplified Manual of Style Getting help Frequently asked questions Cheatsheet Our help forum for new editors, the Teahouse The Help Desk, for more advanced questions Help pages Article Wizard – a Wizard to help you create articles How you can help Community Portal Join a WikiProject Follow Wikipedia etiquette Practice civility Discover what's going on in the Wikimedia community

Welcome to Milhist!

Hello Altair110 and welcome to the Military history WikiProject! As you may have guessed, we're a group of editors working to improve Wikipedia's coverage of topics related to military history.

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If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to ask any of the project coordinators or any other experienced member of the project, and we'll be happy to help you. Again, welcome, and we are looking forward to seeing you around! Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 01:52, 20 October 2020 (UTC)

Mask

Why did you delete from the Justin Turner article the fact that after he was diagnosed with Covid, he took a photo next to a cancer survivor as he was unmasked. Those facts are important to the story. No mask. Cancer survivor.--2604:2000:E010:1100:38DC:1805:F42E:54B2 (talk) 08:47, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Dustin Bates (November 9)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reasons left by IVORK were: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to User:Altair110/Dustin Bates and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you now believe the draft cannot meet Wikipedia's standards or do not wish to progress it further, you may request deletion. Please go to User:Altair110/Dustin Bates, click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window, add "{{Db-g7}}" at the top of the draft text and click the blue "publish changes" button to save this edit.
• If you do not make any further changes to your draft, in 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
• If you need any assistance, or have experienced any untoward behavior associated with this submission, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

— IVORK _Talk 23:27, 9 November 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Altair110! Having an article declined at Articles for Creation can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we'd love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! — IVORK Talk 23:27, 9 November 2020 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Matthew G. Axelson

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A tag has been placed on Matthew G. Axelson requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section G4 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because the page appears to be a repost of material that was previously deleted following a deletion discussion, at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Matthew Axelson. When a page has substantially identical content to that of a page deleted after a discussion, and any changes in the content do not address the reasons for which the material was previously deleted, it may be deleted at any time.

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Nomination of Brad Thomas (soldier) for deletion

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Nominations for the 2020 Military history WikiProject Newcomer and Historian of the Year awards now open

G'day all, the nominations for the 2020 Military history WikiProject newcomer and Historian of the Year are open, all editors are encouraged to nominate candidates for the awards before until 23:59 (GMT) on 15 December 2020, after which voting will occur for 14 days. There is not much time left to nominate worthy recipients, so get to it! Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 06:45, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

Dan Crenshaw

Hello. Great job on adding Crenshaw's military commendations to his page:[1]. I've been meaning to do this myself, but I haven't found the time. Normally, we insert military awards/decorations near the bottom of a BLP article (see:William B. Caldwell IV, Michael X. Garrett, Myles Deering, or for more 'politically-oriented' BLPs such as Tom Cotton or H. R. McMaster). It makes the article overall less clunky. For the Crenshaw article, I think we can leave the "Military service" section where it stands, and simply move the awards section to the bottom. Also, would you mind providing me a source where you found that he was awarded a Navy Rifle Marksmanship Medal, Navy Pistol Marksmanship Medal, Navy and Marine Corps Sea Service Deployment Ribbon, and Navy Good Conduct Medal? I can't seem to find such as source. Thank you! Dr.Swag Lord, Ph.d (talk) 05:12, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

Voting for "Military Historian of the Year" and "Military history newcomer of the year" closing

G'day all, voting for the WikiProject Military history "Military Historian of the Year" and "Military history newcomer of the year" is about to close, so if you haven't already, click on the links and have your say before 23:59 (GMT) on 30 December! Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 23:34, 28 December 2020 (UTC) for the coord team

A barnstar for you!

		The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar
		Thanks for existing. -Shift674-🌀 contribs 16:20, 5 January 2021 (UTC)

Nomination of John Geoghegan for deletion

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April 2021 WikiProject Military History Reviewing Drive

Hey y'all, the April 2021 WikiProject Military History Reviewing Drive begins at 00:01 UTC on April 1, 2021 and runs through 23:59 UTC on April 31, 2021. Points can be earned through reviewing articles on the AutoCheck report, reviewing articles listed at WP:MILHIST/ASSESS, reviewing MILHIST-tagged articles at WP:GAN or WP:FAC, and reviewing articles submitted at WP:MILHIST/ACR. Service awards and barnstars are given for set points thresholds, and the top three finishers will receive further awards. To participate, sign up at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Military_History/April 2021 Reviewing Drive#Participants and create a worklist at Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/April 2021 Reviewing Drive/Worklists (examples are given). Further details can be found at the drive page. Questions can be asked at the drive talk page. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 17:22, 31 March 2021 (UTC)

Your draft article, User:Altair110/Dustin Bates

Hello, Altair110. It has been over six months since you last edited the Articles for Creation submission or Draft page you started, "Dustin Bates".

In accordance with our policy that Wikipedia is not for the indefinite hosting of material deemed unsuitable for the encyclopedia mainspace, the draft has been deleted. If you plan on working on it further and you wish to retrieve it, you can request its undeletion. An administrator will, in most cases, restore the submission so you can continue to work on it.

Thanks for your submission to Wikipedia, and happy editing. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 23:27, 9 May 2021 (UTC)

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Wikiproject Military history coordinator election nominations open

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Wikiproject Military history coordinator election nomination period closing soon

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The WikiEagle - January 2022

The WikiEagle

The WikiProject Aviation Newsletter

Volume I — Issue 1
Aviation Project • Project discussion • Members • Assessment • Outreach • The WikiEagle
Announcements After over a decade of silence, the WikiProject Aviation newsletter is making a comeback under the name The WikiEagle. This first issue was sent to all active members of the project and its sub-projects. If you wish to continue receiving The WikiEagle, you can add your username to the mailing list. For now the newsletter only covers general project news and is run by only one editor. If you wish to help or to become a columnist, please let us know. If you have an idea which you believe would improve the newsletter, please share it; suggestions are welcome and encouraged. On 16 December, an RfC was closed which determined theaerodrome.com to be an unreliable source. The website, which is cited over 1,500 articles, mainly on WWI aviation, as of the publishing of this issue. Luft46.com has been added to the list of problematic sources after this discussion. The Jim Lovell article was promoted to Featured Article status on 26 December after being nominated by Hawkeye7. The Raymond Hesselyn article was promoted to Good Article status on 4 December after being nominated by Zawed. The Supermarine Sea King article was promoted to Good Article status on 22 December after being nominated by Amitchell125. The William Hodgson (RAF officer) article was promoted to Good Article status on 26 December after being nominated by Zawed.
Members New Members KingAviationKid (Joined on 17 December) PatrickChiao (Joined on 22 December) Wp9097 (Joined on 16 December) Number of active members: 386. Total number of members: 921. Closed Discussions Featured Article assessment Jim Lovell (discussion) – Closed as promoted on 26 December 2021 Good Article assessment HAL Tejas (discussion) – Closed as not promoted on 30 December 2021 William Hodgson (RAF officer) (discussion) – Closed as promoted on 26 December 2021 Supermarine Sea King (discussion) – Closed as promoted on 22 December 2021 Raymond Hesselyn (discussion) – Closed as promoted on 4 December 2021 Deletion Timeline of Berlin Brandenburg Airport's construction (discussion) – Closed as delete and redirect on 30 December 2021 Evergreen International Airlines Flight 17 (discussion) – Closed as keep on 25 December 2021 Requested moves Akbarpur (Ambedkar Nagar) Airstrip → Akbarpur Airstrip (discussion) – Closed as moved on 30 December 2021 1983 Avensa Douglas DC-9 crash → Avensa Flight 007 (discussion) – Closed as moved on 30 December 2021 Garuda Indonesia Flight 035 → Garuda Indonesian Airways Flight 035 (discussion) – Withdrawn on 28 December 2021	Article Statistics This data reflects values from DMY. Aviation pages by quality Quality Total FA 142 FL 15 A 56 GA 505 B 4,573 C 11,878 Start 15,082 Stub 18,754 List 2,539 Category 11,638 Disambig 653 File 2,713 Portal 629 Project 89 Redirect 1,518 Template 2,489 NA 66 Assessed 73,339 Unassessed 1 Total 73,340 WikiWork factors (?) ω = 251,880 Ω = 4.92
New/Ongoing Discussions Featured Article review D. B. Cooper (discussion) – Since 14 December 2021 A-class Article assessment Granville Gee Bee Model A (discussion) – Since 21 April 2020 List of aviation shootdowns and accidents during the Iraq War (discussion) – Since 22 February 2010 Good Article assessment Romanian Air Corps (discussion) – Since 25 December 2021 Jean Batten (discussion) – Since 2 October 2021 Merger proposals List of astronauts by name → List of astronauts by year of selection (discussion) – Since 10 August 2021 List of cosmonauts → List of space travelers by nationality (discussion) – Since 10 August 2021 List of space travelers by name → List of space travelers by nationality (discussion) – Since 10 August 2021 Holidays Czech Airlines → Czech Airlines (discussion) – Since 23 June 2021 Bendix Aviation → Bendix Corporation (discussion) – Since 30 May 2021 Airport Movement Area Safety System → Airport Surface Surveillance Capability (discussion) – Since 29 May 2021 ASDE-X → Airport Surface Surveillance Capability (discussion) – Since 28 May 2021 Splitting proposals Family Airlines (discussion) – Since 23 November 2021 2021 Kabul airport attack (discussion) – Since 24 September 2021 List of military aircraft of the United States (discussion) – Since 16 August 2021 Braniff International Airways (discussion) – Since 8 September 2019 Deletion List of maiden voyages (discussion) – Since 29 December 2021 Requested moves Hot-air balloon → Hot air balloon (discussion) – Since 30 December 2021 Aeropostal Alas de Venezuela Flight 108 → Aeropostal Alas de Venezuela Flight 109 (discussion) – Since 28 December 2021 Garuda Indonesia Flight 150 → Garuda Indonesian Airways Flight 150 (discussion) – Since 28 December 2021 Garuda Indonesia Flight 206 → Garuda Indonesian Airways Flight 206 (discussion) – Since 28 December 2021 Garuda Indonesia Flight 708 → Garuda Indonesian Airways Flight 708 (discussion) – Since 28 December 2021 Garuda Indonesia Flight 892 → Garuda Indonesian Airways Flight 892 (discussion) – Since 28 December 2021 TWA Flight 800 → TWA Flight 800 (1996) (discussion) – Since 27 December 2021 Dynamic Airways Flight 405 → Dynamic International Airways Flight 405 (discussion) – Since 26 December 2021 CommutAir Flight 4281 → CommutAir Flight 4821 (discussion) – Since 25 December 2021 Thai Airways → Thai Airways International (discussion) – Since 13 December 2021 Thai Airways fleet → Thai Airways International fleet (discussion) – Since 13 December 2021 List of Thai Airways destinations → List of Thai Airways International destinations (discussion) – Since 13 December 2021 Did you know Ravish Malhotra (discussion) – Since 30 December 2021 Alexander Tahy (discussion) – Since 26 December 2021 Veronica Volkersz (discussion) – Since 6 December 2021 Rudolf Szepessy-Sokoll (discussion) – Since 3 December 2021 On The Main Page Did you know... ... that the aerobatic demonstration aircraft used by SoloTürk is also used in military operations of the Turkish Air Force? (24 December)
Discuss & propose changes to The WikiEagle at The WikiEagle talk page. To opt in/out of receiving this news letter, add or remove your username from the mailing list. Newsletter contributor: ZLEA

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Wikiproject Military history coordinator election voting opening soon!

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Correction to previous election announcement

Just a quick correction to the prior message about the 2022 MILHIST coordinator election! I (Hog Farm) didn't proofread the message well enough and left out a link to the election page itself in this message. The voting will occur here; sorry about the need for a second message and the inadvertent omission from the prior one. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 17:40, 15 September 2022 (UTC)

Wikiproject Military history coordinator election voting closing soon

Voting for the upcoming project coordinator election closes soon, at 23:59 on 28 September. A team of up to ten coordinators will be elected for the next coordination year. The project coordinators are the designated points of contact for issues concerning the project, and are responsible for maintaining our internal structure and processes. They do not, however, have any authority over article content or editor conduct, or any other special powers. More information on being a coordinator is available here. Voting is conducted using simple approval voting and questions for the candidates are welcome. The voting itself is occurring here If you have any questions, you can contact any member of the current coord team. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 20:12, 26 September 2022 (UTC)

Question about CIB

Hi! I noticed you made edits to Randy Shughart and Gary Gordon's pages and I wanted to ask you about how the CIB (and related awards) are awarded. I had thought that for the CIB, CAB, and CMB, one is awarded per eligibility period, with the periods being WWII, Korean War, Vietnam War, any conflict post-Vietnam but before OEF, then OEF/2001 to present. And that if someone saw combat and qualified for the CIB, any subsequent combat they saw during the same period wouldn't qualify them for a second or third award. Like, most recent combat vets from OIF/OEF/OIR would only receive one CIB even if they saw combat in Afghanistan and Iraq (and possibly Syria).

And since the Army basically lumped all conflicts between Vietnam and Afghanistan (Grenada, Panama, Gulf War, Somalia, Kosovo) into one period, someone during that era would only have 1 award. I had thought about whether the only photos of them in uniform show the single award CIB was because their second one was posthumous but I noticed that for veterans of the Battle of Mogadishu who saw combat previously during the Gulf War or Panama or Grenada, then later saw combat in Iraq or Afghanistan (while still eligible), they only had two awards, rather than 3. Like, the reason three CIB awards is so rare is because no one has been alive long enough and still been Colonel or below to have seen combat in Vietnam, a conflict in the 80s or 90s, and in Afghanistan or Iraq.

Am I missing something? I was never enlisted so I don't know first hand. Jasonkwe (talk) (contribs) 17:51, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

Hello there. Just to clarify, yes, a second or third CIB is awarded to an individual who is part of either an infantry or special forces unit who has served in three different wars (WWII, Vietnam, Korea). Both Gary Gordon and Randy Shughart saw combat in Panama thus qualifying for their first CIB, Then later during Mogadishu, which as you said was correct, the second CIB was awarded posthumously. The reason why you have seen veterans who you would think should have earned that 3rd award but don't have it is because combat means you are actively engaging the enemy. What occurred a lot during the Gulf War is that a random RPG or just an explosion in general would hit/occurred about 2 to 5 clicks away from their position (give or take) and automatically soldiers would assume they are in combat, however that was not the case, because the commanding officer was the one who had the final saying as to they should be awarded the CIB, he would review the reports then decide, and in many cases, COs would deny the awards because it was not "active combat". Another reason is that many soldiers would "Re-class" out of either their 11 or 18 series MOS' and of course as I mentioned, the CIB is only awarded to 11 or 18 series soldiers, any other soldier with the exception of in the ones in the medical field, would get the CAB. Medical personal would the receive the CMB. To give you an example, I was awarded the CIB for engaging the enemy in combat during the War on Terror, if I would have re-classed into say a Combat Engineer and saw combat in a war outside the war on terror, then I would be awarded the CAB, but if I stayed in the infantry, then I would have been awarded the second CIB. I hope this helps you out, it can be a bit confusing. Altair110 18:56, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

I understand what you mean about actively engaging the enemy and that being in the same general area as an attack doesn't count. What I was unsure about was the qualifying periods. Like you said, if you saw combat as infantry or non-infantry in a war outside the GWOT, you would have qualified for a second CIB. But since 2001 to now has all been lumped into one qualifying period that's not possible for the time being. What I was seeing was that the entire period from the end of Vietnam to beginning of OEF was also classed as one qualifying period. So even though Panama, Grenada, Somalia, Gulf War, etc. were all separate conflicts, they all were counted as being in the same qualifying period. So the only way Gordon and Shughart could've had earned a second CIB would've been if they fought in Vietnam and they were way too young for that.

Oh, what I meant about people who I would've thought would have 3 CIB's was actually when comparing to other participants in the Battle of Mogadishu, like Jeff Struecker saw combat in Panama, Somalia, and Iraq and Afghanistan; he has 1 CIB and 1 CAB, not 2 CIB's. Same for Mike Steele and several others. Am I misunderstanding how the qualifying period works? Jasonkwe (talk) (contribs) 21:20, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

Well, you see that from 2001 to present, every battle/war has all been in relation to the war on terror, and I'll use myself as an example. I served in both in Iraq and Afghanistan, been in active combat against the enemy numerous of time, couldn't really tell you a number but even I served in two wars, but they both fall under the war on terror (the main war) which is why I only have one CIB that I can officially wear, because they both part of the same conflict in general. For Panama and Grenada, both of those war fall under the cold war, so just like the war on terror, it's the same qualifying period. The gulf war was its own thing because it had to do with Saddam's attempt to invade Kuwait, and though the cold war was still ongoing, it was already on its final stages of coming to an end, and if you read into, you'll see that the Soviet Union had no part in the gulf war because it was already dealing with issues of its own, making the gulf war a war of its own. Same thing in for Somalia, it was its own war, no relation to the gulf war or cold war.

I can explain that. MAJ Struecker was an enlisted infantryman with the 3rd Ranger Battalion during Mogadishu, but as I explained in my previous message about soldiers "re-classing", Struecker re-classed to become Chaplain after receiving a commission, because only officers are able to become Chaplains. Chaplains are not eligible for CIB, they receive CABs, which is why he only has a one CIB and a CAB due to the fact he saw combat during the war on terror with a non-infantry or special forces MOS. If he would have stayed an infantryman and been in active combat in Iraq or Afghanistan, he would have two CIBs. As for COL Steele, I can assure you he has two CIBs, He was my brigade commander. For the most part you pretty much have qualifying periods down but like I said they can be confusing at some points. If there is still confusion, feel free to ask me, I don't mind. Altair110 00:04, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

@Altair110Thanks, I appreciate your answers. And sorry about the imprecise wording. What I had meant with Struecker was to ask wouldn't he have had 2 CIB (Panama and Somalia) as well as his CAB from when he was a chaplain? And for Steele, I definitely saw pictures of him with 2 CIB but was wondering if he should've qualified for 3 CIB between Panama, Somalia, and Iraq/Afghanistan if that were the case.

I was mainly going off the wiki page for the CIB and, I guess AR 600-8-22 which it paraphrases. I think I actually misspoke as it said on page 106 that all of Vietnam and post-Vietnam was one qualifying period (I mistakenly said that Vietnam was its own qualifying period when it doesn't seem like it was). I'm just not sure if I'm massively misinterpreting this is all.

Incidentally, no way! I guess...you were 187th? Damn, you were in during OIF. That was a hell of a time to be enlisted. Jasonkwe (talk) (contribs) 02:29, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

You're welcome, I'm always happy to help in any way I can. The thing with Panama is that not everyone who was deployed there saw combat. Some ranger battalions, and special forces groups had a certain few that never saw combat, they were there as advisors mainly. The units that saw the most combat during Panama were the Army's 2nd Ranger Battalion, the 7th Special Forces Group, the elite SMU, Delta Force, the Air Force's 24th Special Tactics Squadron, and The Navy's elite SEAL Team Six. Gary Gordon was deployed to Panama but didn't see combat until the Gulf War. Randy Shughart did deploy and Saw combat in Panama but never deployed to the Gulf War. So that is the have two why they have two. Mike Steele and Jeff Struecker unfortunately never saw combat in these two conflicts, although they were deployed there. US Military was trying to keep American service members away from deadly situations as much as possible, hence to why some members didn't see combat.

Oh wow, how in the world did you guess the 187th? you are correct by the way. It literally was an experience I will never forget. You served too? Altair110 03:20, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

I understand not everyone saw combat in panama. I remember doing a deep dive into Gary Gordon's records and found the entirety of his military record are actually up at the National Archive. It's kinda creepy actually, they didn't just upload his enlistment papers and transfer records but his annual evaluations, dental x rays, photo of his wife (as she was next of kin) as well. It's over here. Though I think this stuff was obtained via FOIA or uploaded by family so it's not like all vets have this much info about them uploaded into the archive. Actually, looking at it again, it says Gordon was awarded his CIB for actions during Panama (page 86). The other weird thing is that he apparently was awarded a Bronze Star for meritorious achievement during his Somalia deployment but there's not a single source out there that mentions this. But the documentation for the Bronze star is on page 155. I dunno what to make of it.

The thing I'm still not sure about is the stuff from AR 600-8-22 on page 106 that says that any combat from 1961 to 1995 counts under the 3rd qualifying period so Panama, Gulf War, and Somalia can't give eligibility for separate CIBs.

I didn't serve but just have a lot of interest in mil stuff. I looked into an Army medical scholarship while in grad school so I could serve in healthcare after graduation but got the cold shoulder because I'd require several medical waivers and the recruiting sergeant didn't seem interested in betting on a long shot.

Oh, I guessed 187th because I worked on Steele's wiki page finding a picture for it–was able to dredge up some photos taken by enlisted photographers that were uploaded to dvids hub and used the best I could find from there. I read over his page to make sure I didn't fuck up the image's caption and saw that he was brigade commander of 3rd BCT 101st Airborne in '06 and saw that its infantry units currently are 187th and 506th but 506th wasn't assigned to 3 BCT until 2014 ish. Sorry, didn't mean to make that creepy lol. Jasonkwe (talk) (contribs) 19:25, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

Sources for additions at Matt Best

Hi, I was wondering what your source for the personal information[2] you added to the BLP Matt Best was. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 17:55, 3 October 2022 (UTC)

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