User talk:Charles01/Archive 27

Lefaucheux Memorial

What a great photograph of the memorial... do you have a way to locate that on mapquest or some other mapping service? If so, I could decipher the GPS coordinates -- understanding that the memorial's location is not the same location as the accident. Do you have an idea of where the actual accident occurred?842U (talk) 17:01, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for taking the trouble to write something nice about the picture. I, too, thought it was ok+. Sometimes the authorities put the sun in the right place (though usually they do not....

I GUESS the accident occurred about 70 metres to the south of the memorial. The road round the north side of St Dizier now has modern tower blocks along the north side, but in the 1950s I assume it was the then newly/recently/about to be constructed bye-pass. (Since about 2008 there's a newer byepass round the south side of the town, though I think that was closed for repairs at the first weekend in June 2013 when I was there with a camera handy.) The link with the dead straight east-west road THROUGH St Dizier is now, at the town's westside (Paris/Reims side) is now a smoothed out curve which is how the memorial is now further away from the road than (I guess) it was. But the accident was well reported at the time and if you follow the sources on the wiki page about M LeF. Probably also the local Syndicat d'initiatif/Tourist office could direct you to more info. If you want to place reliance on something more reliable than my speculation, therefore, I think that would be a very good idea!

On a location for the image, someone did show me how to do that a year or so ago. I'll see if I can still remember how to do it. I agree that it's a good idea in this case. Success Charles01 (talk) 09:29, 5 June 2013 (UTC)

PS - out of curiosity, if you enter "Charles01 (talk) 09:29, 5 June 2013 (UTC)" (without the "" bit) it will become possible for me to know who you are without having to dig. Just a minor thought, and not an important one if your actually intended to be anonymous....

I forgot how to insert a location to a wiki page. BUT if you use google maps, go to St Dizier. On the west side of the town is a roundabout (rond point) where D635 (from the east) meets D221 (from the north) meets Av Roger Salengro (from the town). Just to the south of D635 is marked a pub/bar called "Relais des Nations". North of that is an unofficial looking road with "one way/sense unique" arrows pointing more or less west. North of that is a very short L shaped road going first north then west then stopping. From (recent!) memory, I would estimate the LeFacheux monument is at the end of that little L-shaped non-road to nowhere, just south of where the D635 is about to reach the rond point. I tried to check that using google satellite, but the resulting image is too fuzzy to check anything. Here it is, though, in case helpful (don't know if this will work...):

https://www.google.co.uk/mapmaker?splash=1&ll=48.640091,4.916822&spn=0.002854,0.004823&t=m&z=18&vpsrc=6&q=St+Dizier&hl=en

IF you can remember or work out how to add the coordinates for that to the file of the picture, please do it. And thank you. Regards Charles01 (talk) 09:56, 5 June 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the info. I do not speak French well enough to have located any information on the monument. It's my understanding [Mine too, but all they did was smooth out a corner, so it's not very far away] that the actual spot where Lefaucheux had his accident has been displaced by the rework of the intersection. In either case, I will add the geo-position to the article later today. Thanks! 842U (talk) 13:24, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

Also, I've added information to the French article, do you think you could take a look at that and see if it makes sense?842U (talk) 17:31, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

Thank you. Your contribution to French wiki works just fine for me (though it's not my mother tongue...) And the locations are spot on. Charles01 (talk) 19:09, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

Cool! 842U (talk) 15:59, 16 July 2013 (UTC)

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Le Simca Mille

Great to see you help in furthering the Simca articles. I have also noticed that Morgan +4 as well as Morgan Plus 8 are nearly stumps. And why are they titled differently? Would welcome your input and content there (minus crazy spaces!). Cheers,  Mr.choppers | ✎  06:21, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

I'm slightly surprised that there's so little on - in particular - the Morgan +4. You'd think there would be more enthusiasts out there keen to share what they know. There is a little bit of info in Culshaw and Horrobin. Motor magazines from my own youth tend to be about five years too late for the Plus 4. Even though they made it till 1969 (it says here) the focus of media interest had by then switched to the V8 powered Plus 8. I guess that may offer a clue as to where some of the enthusiasts for the +4 have gone, alas. Anyhow, for my part I'll bear it in mind and should the muse strike ..... but please feel free to get in first if ever you should find that your own muse is twitching to go in that direction.

(On the 1950s/60s Simcas I was inspired a couple of years back, as you can doubtless tell, by having found - paid for even - a great source. That and the memories - mostly happy - of having visited France on holiday as a kid with the parents and noticing that the cars were all quite different from the ones back home (or in Germany, or, presumably, in Italy and to a lesser extent in Sweden, though I think for little cars the Swedes were importing from other European countries in relatively large numbers even then). I never mustered quite the same enthusiasm for Morgans, in that I've never known one "personally" and when I was a kid, on the rare occasions that you saw one on the road, there was always a slight frisson of disappointment as it got closer and you realized that it wasn't an interesting car to try and identify from thirty years ago but "only a Morgan". Though of course you can't really blame the cars for that.)

Happy days Charles01 (talk) 07:09, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

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1947 (?) Packard Clipper

Hi. I'm frequently writing on Packard themes in the German WP and stumbled upon the fine pics of the Clipper you uploaded. I doubt that it is possible to distinguish 1946 from 1947 Clipper models by paint scheme. To my knowledge, this is only possible by VIN, and there by body style number only, as all 1946 and 1947 Clippers are part of the 21st series. That means that all VINs start with 21xx. The Packard Club encyclopedia states for 1946 and 1947 simultaneously:

The Twenty-First series spanned 1946 and 1947. Packards produced during the 1946 "model year" have body style numbers in the 16XX series, while those produced for sale as 1947 models have body styles numbers in the 21XX series. There are no other differences between 1946 and 1947 Packards.

Further proof is given by this picture which shows the leaflet cover of the entry-level Clipper Six for 1946.--Chief tin cloud (talk) 22:49, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Food for thought. Thank you. They were good quite pictures in the circumstances. Sometimes - not often - the Weather-god puts the sun in the right place. If ever I see that car again, I'll try and hang around for long enough to find the owner and ask a few questions. There's another old timer show at Schaffen-Diest (between Aachen and Antwerpen) in mid-August 2013, I think. Maybe maybe maybe. (And if you are in or near to NRW, quite accessible from BRD). Those Belgians bought a lot of US cars in the decade 1945-1955. I'm not sure why. They were even assembling Studebakers in what became the Volkswagen Brussels plant.

The car looks in such good condition that MUCH work must have been done on it. That could easily include changing the paint scheme. However, I have the sense that the person who did the work is a person who values authenticity. Dating any US car from these decades is complicated by confusion between "model years" and "production years". In principal we all know the difference, but in practice and when discussing individual cars, confusion can still enter the discussion!

None of which takes the discussion too far further. I need to get on with Tuesday. Have a good day and thanks for the link. I'll take a longer look at that later. Charles01 (talk) 05:48, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter

Hey Charles01. We've just rolled out a new version of the VisualEditor :). Changes and patches include:

• Newly added templates now list their available parameters if TemplateData is available;
• The load for the VisualEditor on apages is now 4 KiB, down from 119 KiB;
• Feedback dialog is no longer chased off the screen by typing (bug 50538)
• Fixed the Monobook issues around z-indexes (bug 50241)
• Undoing an image resize doesn't make everything look bad
• In the image dialog, "Caption content" is now just "Caption"
• Tweaked tooltip references to VisualEditor to instead talk about "source mode"

Those are the big ones; more coming at the end of this week or early next week :). It's a short list, but the load issue took up a lot of time, as did TemplateData, and are both pretty big changes. If you've got any questions, drop them on my talkpage. Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 01:24, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

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VisualEditor newsletter

Hey Charles01! We've just deployed some fixes to the VisualEditor. These include:

• "Edit" will load the latest version, not the version you're looking at (bug 49943)
• "Edit" will load the latest version, not the version you edited last time if this is your second edit (bug 50441)
• VE edit section links will load the latest, not original, version in diff view preview (bug 50925)
• <big><big>Foo</big></big> and similar repeated tags will not get corrupted any more (bug 49755)

In the meantime, testing is proceeding well, and hopefully we can get some more fixes out over the next couple of days. If you're interested in helping out, we have a set of open tasks we'd really appreciate your assistance with :). Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 08:01, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

VE newsletter

Hey Charles01

We just deployed another VisualEditor release; bugs fixed include:

• Firefox 13/14 has been temporarily blacklisted, to avoid the insertion of broken links [[./that look like this]] (50720)
• Changing a reference in a template should no longer produce the bright red "you don't have a references block!" error (bugzilla:50423)
• Notices are now shown if you're editing a protected or semi-protected page (bugzilla:50415)
• The template inspector will no longer invite you to insert parameters that are already being used (50715)
• Same as above, but with aliases (50717)
• Parameter names in the template dialogue now word-wrap (50800)
• The link inspector will not show in the top left if you hit the return key while opening it (49941)
• Hitting return twice in the link editor will no longer introduce a new line that overwrites the link (51075)
• Oddly-named categories no longer cause corruption (50702)
• The toolbar no longer occasionally covers the cursor (48787)
• Changing the formatting of text no longer occasionally scrolls you upwards (50792)

Not specific bugs, but other things; cacheing is now improved, so people should stop seeing temporary breaking when the VisualEditor updates, and RTL support has received some patches. I hope this newsletter is helpful to people; I'll send out another one with the next deployment :). Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 10:12, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

VE newsletter

Hey Charles01! Another set of patches :). Today we have:

• Required template parameters are now automatically added to new templates (50747)
• Templates with piped links now display correctly when you alter them (50801)
• If your edit token expires, you're now informed of it (50424).

  You still won't be able to save - that's due to be fixed on Monday :).

More on Monday, I suspect. Hope you have a good weekend :). I should also have some news about the IP launch pretty soon. Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 13:20, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

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VE newsletter

Hey Charles01; hope you had a decent weekend :). We've got a pile of patches, some of which went out on Monday, some yesterday:

• If you insert wikitext such as links or section headers, you get a notice in the top right corner (over the save button). It doesn't go away until click, though once dismissed you don't get another one that edit. (49820)
• If your edit token expires, VE fetches a new one for you so you can save. (50424)
• If the page is empty of content but does have something non-content (like a category or an HTML comment), VE no longer crashes on load - (50289)
• sub tags are no longer removed ((49873)
• If you type at the end of links, they now extend
• Templates now only take a single click to insert
• Clear annotations clears links (50461)
• The link inspector stays open when you click to another item (50895)
• Typing after multi-byte characters no longer creats pawn icons (51140)
• Resizing thumbnails that have a default size set now works (50645)
• References made by tag:ref now display properly (bugzilla:50978)
• The VE is integrated with the spam blacklist (50826)
• Feedbacl link goes to the right language (bugzilla:47730)

There are a lot more improvements coming, but that's it for Monday and Tuesday. Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 08:22, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

Decrees

Hello Charles,

I saw your work on Bierut Decrees which brought me to Beneš Decrees. I am doing their list in my [User:Cimmerian praetor/sandbox sandbox] now. Please feel invited to give me any ideas on what to add or how to make it better (or copy-edit).

On the Beneš Decrees, I'll share any compelling thoughts that come to me. However, it's something about which I know very little so beyond pointing out where you left out a "the" or an "a", I'm unlikely to bring any very penetrating insights to the entries. My interest originates simply because when we lived in Germany we had friends whose parents had left those eastern lands - "Sudetan Germans" in 1945. Inevitably, if that's your family background, you don't quite view the planet from the same set of angles as you do where your family has been living quietly in the same settled German village for five generations. And of course the history of the massive ethnic cleansings (if one may use the phrase without being deemed biased) that followed the Second World War is largely a closed history to the English speaking world, though I guess little by little various resources - including wikipedia - open up the opportunity better to understand history the way she was taught in countries other than the one where one grew up. Or didn't.

Also, as regards Bierut, I think that the article does not address the issue of to what degree they were the basis for the expulsion and to what degree they were "merely" facilitating the Article 12 of the Potsdam Agreement.

I think I probably agree. My motivation for starting this one was simply curiosity and the vague sense that this entry should not be reserved for people wiling and able to read it in German. Thus far I really only trusted myself enough to translate what was already there, so inevitably I tend to copy any unconscious (and conscious?) nuances from the German language text. Whoever translated it for the French-wiki appears to come to the thing with some background knowledge, but in large part what he provides is also a translation from the German text. And I've not yet found on-line (or anywhere else) the texts of the laws and decrees themselves. It would be good to be able to link to those and maybe get a better perspective on how far the bits that do get described and quoted in the German wiki entry are representative of all the (far greater number of) bits that don't get a mention. I only have about 20 words of Polish (and when I used to visit Poland occasionally my 20 words of Polish sometimes used to merge into my 40 words of Russian which I don't think always pleased people) but with google translate one can sometimes get some sort of a limited idea of what is going on even where one does not know the language. And of course in terms of sentence structure, simply watching how you adapt your thought processes (presumably originating in a middle European language) into English provides a (yes, very small) amount of increased insight into word order etc (and the absence of "the" and "a"!).

Anyhow, if you have insights to add on the Bierut Decrees, that would be seriously interesting to see. I'm not expecting to go significantly beyond translation myself, unless I get unexpectedly lucky with some on-line source(s). Maybe if you did a quick translation into Czech (for wiki?) you would be unable to resist checking out Czech language (and other slavic language) sources which might add balance and some source notes which would give the entry authority. Though it is possible that there simply are not too many published Polish language sources available, in view of the situation under the Russians in the decades immediately after 1945.

I am sure there is a sense in which the Potsdam agreement, on these issues, was a face-saving device to try and give legitimacy to what had already happened and preserve the idea that The Allies were allies. Stalin had a plan for Mittel Europa and he had armies in the affected countries. He had had decades in which to think about it. Going back, there was a long tradition of carving up between the surrounding empires Poland (and other countries around it) and then recarving the frontiers half a century later, even if the scale of the forced migrations of ethnic Germans resulting in 1945 was on a vast scale. (Of course there were also under Stalin whole towns in Poland that had their populations picked up and relocated deep in the Soviet heartland / southern Siberia, though in the west we hear even less about that than we hear about the transfers of German populations in '45.) Anyhow, faced with a long standing Russian strategy backed by Soviet troops in all the right places, it's understandable that Harry Truman and Clem Attlee at Potsdam simply signed up to what was. There was also, in the decade 1945-55, understandable concern that the Third World War would take place in Europe between the USSR and the USA, and I guess avoiding that outcome at all costs will have been a major priority for Stalin, Truman and Attlee. And in terms of crude military strategy, while the existence of "buffer" states under soviet control between the Soviet Union and Western Europe during the Cold War certainly would have discouraged any sudden invasion from the west into the Soviet Union, it also served the same function in reverse. It would have been difficult for the Soviets to invade western Europe through the intervening countries without risking military "insurgency" from behind, even if Poland etc were under some sort of Soviet control. I don't think that control was ever entirely unconditional....

Ho hum. Enjoy the weekend. Charles01 (talk) 10:35, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Best, Cimmerian praetor (talk) 09:33, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

I have done my best with the Beneš Decrees article. I will fiddle a bit more with adding sources tomorrow, but otherwise it is ready for copy-edit. I want to put it on the main page at once so that it is eligible for the DYK nomination (expanded five fold within last five days), but anyhow if you consider it interesting enough for your copy-edit, you can start already at the sandbox. It might take me another weekend or two before I am satisfied enough with the outcome to let it out there. F€@k, another Saturday spent on Wikipedia instead of writing master thesis which is, by now, clinically dead :(

The worst part of the expulsions took place already by the end of the war and the worst crimes were, at least from what I have read so far as regards the Czech part, often committed by former Czech collaborators who were on one hand trying to erase witnesses of their collaboration or had bestial idea of proving loyalty to the reinstated government (e.g. Massacre at Švédské Šance, the main perpetrator of which falls in both categories). Considering the way the occupation was carried out, I understand that coexistence in the same country was not imaginable in May 1945. And when reading decree No. 16 (see description in the list), I fear that there would be many more people hanged (for treason, etc.) than how many have lost lives in during the expulsion. Being Silesian, from first invaded by Poland and then Germany, I have also interesting family history... suffice to say that had greatgrandfather not fallen serving in Wehrmacht making grandpa an orphan, this part of my ancestors would be also expelled. Best, Cimmerian praetor (talk) 21:04, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

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Featuring your work on Wikipedia's front page: DYKs

Thank you for your recent articles, including Bierut Decrees, which I read with interest. When you create an extensive and well referenced article, you may want to have it featured on Wikipedia's main page in the Did You Know section. Articles included there will be read by thousands of our viewers. To do so, add your article to the list at T:TDYK. Let me know if you need help, Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 13:10, 25 July 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject assessment tags for talk pages

Thank you for your recent articles, including Bierut Decrees. When you create a new article, can you add the WikiProject assessment templates to the talk of that article? See the talk page of the article I mentioned for an example of what I mean. Usually it is very simple, you just add something like {{WikiProject Keyword}} to the article's talk, with keyword replaced by the associated WikiProject (ex. if it's a biography article, you would use WikiProject Biography; if it's a United States article, you would use WikiProject United States, and so on). You do not have to rate the article if you do not want to, others will do it eventually. Those templates are very useful, as they bring the articles to a WikiProject attention, and allow them to start tracking the articles through Wikipedia:Article alerts and other tools. This can help you too, as the WikiProject members will often defend your work from deletion and try to improve it further. Feel free to ask me any questions if you'd like more information. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 13:10, 25 July 2013 (UTC)

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Mystery photo

Hi, do you recall where this photo was taken? The file description says Weston; but there are lots of those. --Redrose64 (talk) 15:26, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

I took the liberty of checking out your user page. It looks as though you live in England and once lived in Telford, so I don't need to tell you where Wolverhampton and Telford are. Good. The Weston in question is Weston Park, just off the long mostly straight old road if you turn off at Weston under Lizard and/or Shiffnal. As far as I remember from the rather approximate map in my head, if you travel by road from Wolverhampton to Telford (shunning the motorway) you will drive past / through Weston. In the old days Weston Park was the home of the Earl of Bradford, but I think he runs a posh restaurant in London these days and the house/park are probably operated by quasi-benign publicly funded bureaucrats allegedly for the benefit of all.

The occasion was a "transport fair" (or words to that effect) held normally during the first weekend in May each year (ie Bank holiday weekend - though this year it was defered to celebrate weather). It's a great place for checking out old cars and trucks (unless it rains, in which case the old-timer enthusiasts and their cars/trucks/buses tend to stay away). The cars are gathered on a piece of park land to the south of the big house and the trucks are mostly parked up in a row to the west of the cars - so to the south-west of the house. At least, that's the been the set-up when I've attended.

Regards Charles01 (talk) 15:47, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

Thanks; that's somewhat more than I required - here's what I needed the info for. --Redrose64 (talk) 16:17, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter for 06 August 2013

It's been almost two weeks since the last newsletter, and a lot of improvements have been made during that time. The main things that people have noticed are significant improvements to speed for typing into long pages (T54012), scrolling (T54014) and deleting (T54013) on large pages. There have also been improvements to references, with the latest being support for list-defined references, which are <ref>s defined inside a <references> block (T53741). Users of Opera 12 and higher have had their web browser removed from the browser black-list, mostly as a result of work by a volunteer developer (T38000). Opera has not been fully white-listed yet, so these users will get an additional warning and request to report problems.

Significant changes were made to the user interface to de-emphasize VisualEditor. This has cut the use of VisualEditor by approximately one-third. You can read about these at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Updates/August 1, 2013, but they include:

• Re-ordering links to the editors to put "Edit source" first and VisualEditor second
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• Disabling the animation for section editing.
• Changing all labels for the classic wikitext editor to say "Edit source", regardless of namespace.

There have also been many smaller fixes, including these:

• Horizontal alignment of images working correctly on more pages (T53995)
• Categories with ':'s in their names (like Category:Wikipedia:Privacy) now work correctly (T53902)
• Magic JavaScript gadgets and tools like sortable tables will now work once the page is saved (T53565)
• Keyboard shortcut for "clear annotations" - now Control+\ or ⌘ Command+\ (T53507)
• Fixed corruption bugs that led to duplicate categories (T54238) and improper collapsing when multiple new references were added in a row (T54228).
• Improvements to display elements: The save dialog in Monobook is restored to normal size (T52058), pop-up notices on save now look the same in VisualEditor as in wikitext editor (T41632), and the popup about using wikitext has a link to the definition of wikitext that now opens in a new window (T54093)

Most of the Wikimedia Foundation staff is traveling this week and next, so no updates are expected until at least August 15th. If you're going to be in Hong Kong for Wikimania 2013, say hello to James Forrester, Philippe Beaudette, and the other members of the VisualEditor team.

As always, if you have questions or suggestions, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting problem reports at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and ideas at Wikipedia talk:VisualEditor. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) 23:31, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

August 2013

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• novels (the other being ''[[Therese (novel)|Therese]]'') by this [[Wiener Moderne|Viennese author]]) 1862-1931) better known for his short stories and plays (including ''Reigen'' - "Round Dance" - known to most

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VisualEditor newsletter for 21 August 2013

Both VisualEditor and MediaWiki were upgraded recently. For VisualEditor, this is the long-awaited post-Wikimania update with many bug fixes and enhancements. Work also continues on speed at opening and during use, as well as on the bugs reported here and at other Wikipedias. The full report is at Mediawiki.

References are displaying properly, even when nested (T52749) or in image captions (T2000. Reference lists are now always fully populated with references (bug 50094). Firefox users can insert an existing reference in the first paragraph (T54159). Opera users no longer see corruption of categories when a reference was added (bug 50385).

Stray spaces are being stripped from the start of paragraphs to end one of the common <nowiki> problems (T53462). We also fixed a round-tripping bug that caused desirable whitespace in templates (used to make templates more legible, e.g., by putting each parameter in an infobox on a separate line) to get corrupted (bug 51150).

Wikilink handling was improved. Users are not allowed to create internal links to invalid titles (titles that are actually impossible due to limits on acceptable character combinations in titles, not redlinks) (T35094). You can extend wikilinks, but it won't do so over a wordbreak (like a space) (bugs 49931 and 51463).

A handful of fixes to the user interface were made. The toolbar doesn't float over personal tools after opening a dialog or the inspector (T54441). Toolbars were also re-written to be collapsible/expandable, with room for more icons. Buttons in dialogs can now be activated using the Tab ↹ and ⇧ Shift+Tab ↹ key commands (bug 50047). This saves time for editors, because you don't need to take your hands off the keyboard to click a button. We fixed a handful of bugs that affected only certain articles or certain browsers, including toolbar buttons in Firefox (bug 51986) and dialog panels that didn't always scroll correctly (bug 51739). Bugs with undo/redo getting confused have been fixed (T54113).

Images, in addition to getting references displaying correctly, also saw improvements with a set-empty |link= parameter no longer corrupted (51963). We corrected thumbnail images' display so that they look don't wrong in some contexts (bug 51995). Inserted images no longer explicitly set their alignment, but instead inherit the default position in compliance with the Manual of Style (bug 51851).

More edit notices, warnings, and metadata like information about Pending Changes on an article now appear as appropriate (bug 49699). When new articles are created, users are now shown the <newarticletext> message (bug 51459). VisualEditor now handles templates that set "meta" items (like a category) and nothing else better (bug 51322). If the database is locked when a user tries to save with VisualEditor, they now get a message telling them as such and an opportunity to try again, rather than a silent failure (bug 51636).

When you save the page, having the default preference set to "mark all my edits as minor by default" no longer overrides the setting in the save dialog (bug 51515). If you open VisualEditor from a section edit link, the section's title will be pre-filled in in the edit summary box when you go to save it (bug 50872). The size of the save dialog box in the Monobook skin has been fixed (bug 50058). Also, wikipage content handlers like sortable tables are re-run automatically after saving (T53565).

A very early version of the mathematics equation editor is now available for testing on mw:Mediawiki. If you would like to help improve the user interface for math editor, please test out the extension at mw:Mediawiki:Sandbox and leave your comments directly at the discussion page for the Math Node User Interface at Mediawiki. You should be able to use your regular username and password should to login to Mediawiki.

For other questions or suggestions, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting problem reports at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and other ideas at Wikipedia talk:VisualEditor. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) 17:50, 21 August 2013 (UTC)

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Disambiguation

Greetings Charles01. I grew up to think of the kind of soft top car with cant rails over the doors and windows (perhaps because so popular in mainland Europe) was a cabriolet rather than a tourer or all-weather car. What is your experience of the use of this word, cabriolet? Best, Eddaido (talk) 21:37, 2 September 2013 (UTC)

• 
  Cabriolet
• 
  Cant rail
• 
  Cabriolet
• 
  Cabriolet not

small soft-top cabriolet

mid-size soft-top cabriolet

Hmmmmm

I think the little Austin can be called a cabriolet, though I'm not sure I'd do it myself. Not sure why. Just too English a car for such a French name, maybe. How about "Austin 7 soft-top convertible"? (Assuming it is an Austin 7.) I see Lars-Göran has called it a cabriolet and I wouldn't get into a fight with him or anyone else over that application of the term. Just wouldn't apply it myself.

The second one looks like part of a train.

With the standard 2CV the idea was to save cost and weight. There were a lot of German cars like that in the 1930s where the soft top saloon was maybe 100 marks less expensive than the hard top saloon - per examples on the right.. It's not really a question of letting the sunshine in to decorate your bikini-clad passenger, though. How about "soft-top saloon" (or soft-top sedan if your readers are predominantly American)?

The fourth one is what I call a cabriolet.

BUT I am not sure that you should expect universal consensus on some of this. I'm pretty sure that until I was about 40 we'd have said "convertible". Then the word "cabriolet" edged across the channel from France, as "coupé" and "couchette" had done a few decades earlier (and "GT" from Italy at some stage). I guess we just like foreign words in our language zones. Happy day. Charles01 (talk) 06:21, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

Austin 10 Colwyn Cabriolet 1935

Austin 10 Conway 4-door cabriolet March 1938

The first mention I have of Cabriolet in relation to an Austin car is is this :
Olympia Prices for Austin motor-cars.

• Austin 10-4
• saloon de luxe £172.10.0
• saloon (fixed head) £158.0.0
• cabriolet £178.0.0
• four seater £152.0.0 (this means an open tourer)
• two-seater £152.0.0
• sports tourer £215.0.0
• 6cwt - 8cwt van £172.10.0

from The Times Tuesday, Aug 15, 1933; pg. 8; Issue 46523

Thereafter it remains in the catalogue until the outbreak of war, latterly as the (10) Conway cabriolet. Its the kind of thing Herbert Austin seems to have been all fussy about. There was an upgrade when the body shape changed which is described here. I know I have switched from a 7 to a 10 but the same applies except that it is a Pearl instead of a Conway.

Important if minor point, a firm called Salmons & Sons made their own cabriolet with a (I think patented so I think "proprietary") wind up and down handle using bowden cables in the cant rails and they called it Tickford after the name of their street and it was very popular.

Good heavens! You're right, my fancied railroad car is but a railway carriage and not set to whip them from Grand Central to SFO in just one day.

I have raised the matter to get it on record. I'm pretty confident that I am correct as far as pre-war British useage is concerned but if my railroad car is just another carriage my vote is just for clarification of all these words used to describe particular types of vehicle allocating them to their localities and periods and not the current consignment to a muddle for which some googling gives a false "authority". The moment a citation is demanded is the moment the required citations all hide. This day has been much nicer than all the four preceding it, thank you. May you be every bit as fortunate - Eddaido (talk) 05:16, 4 September 2013 (UTC)

Tickford post & rail (cabriolet) construction

Well I never. I've just looked at this and I see the author (Bill Smith) has expressed confusion over the use of cabriolet in the Armstrong-Siddeley catalogue - there are 15 separate pages to consider. It seems to me that a Salmons all-weather car has cant rails (so I would say is really a cabriolet). Can you see any underlying (Armstrong-Siddeley) logic? Does the word cabriolet lend the product something special in the mind of the copywriter? Regards, Eddaido (talk) 23:28, 4 September 2013 (UTC)

Some more links: Salmons cabriolet in Flickr Salmons Tickford i.e. without the word cabriolet Tickford cabriolet gives you my kind of cabriolet from Austin 7s to Rolls What do you think? Eddaido (talk) 01:41, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

typically Tickford Cabriolet on a Daimler chassis Eddaido (talk) 12:24, 7 September 2013 (UTC)

Lots of elegant cars. As for the word cabriolet, it looks as though it was common currency in the english speaking world further back than I would confidently have known. But I guess it makes sense. The largest car producing nation by far back around 1900 was France, so it's logical that several of the more important words which became necessary to describe different types and aspect of cars that developed in those early years should have migrated from French to English, often barely digested (eg the use of é in coupé even though I think our language doesn't really reckon to "do" accents). But I still think that at least in England itself, during my childhood, "convertible" was preferred to "cabriolet" if only because you don;t need to take time out to wonder whether to pronounce it as though a French word or as though an english word. But these days I guess the word cabriolet is right back in there and you never hear the word "convertible" in this context. Well, I guess we've all lived long enough to observe how languages mutate and no doubt there are scholarly theses by linguistics professors on the subject. Ho hum. Regards Charles01 (talk) 22:23, 7 September 2013 (UTC)

You seem to have ignored the whole point! In the first half of the 20th century cabriolet, in Britain, was the kind of car illustrated in all those links to elegant cars, the kind like the basic Citroen 2CV with a fence on either side of the passengers when the top was down. What ia now known as a convertible was a simple all-weather car, with a fence then it was an all-wether cabriolet (Freudian slip). Go look again at those "elegant car" pictures, I didn't name them. Ho hum? Spring is here, Happy Sunday, Eddaido (talk) 00:43, 15 September 2013 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter for September 5

This Thursday's VisualEditor update was mostly about stability and performance improvements, and some preparatory work for major planned improvements, along with bug fixes for non-English language support and right-to-left text. Everything that the English Wikipedia received today has been running on Mediawiki for a week already.

Officially, the problem with the link inspector not linking to a specific section on a page (bug 53219) was fixed in this release, although that critical patch actually appeared here earlier.

A number of bugs related to copy-and-paste functionality were fixed (48604, bug 50043, bug 53362, bug 51538, among others). Full rich copy-and-paste from external sources into VisualEditor is expected "soon".

In other fixes, you can no longer add empty ref tags (<ref/>) (bug 53345). Selecting both an image and some text, and then trying to add a link, previously deleted the selected image and the text. This was fixed in bug 50127. There was another problem related to using arrow keys to move the cursor next to an inline image that was fixed (bug 53507).

Looking ahead: The next planned upgrade is scheduled for next Thursday, and you should expect to find a redesigned toolbar with drop-down menus that include room for references, templates, underline, strikethrough, superscript, subscript, and code formatting. There will also be keyboard shortcuts for setting the format (paragraph vs section headings).

If you are active at other Wikipedias, the next group of Wikipedias to have VisualEditor offered to all users is being determined at this time. Generally speaking, languages that depend on the input method editor are not going to receive VisualEditor this month. The current target date is Tuesday, September 24 for logged-in users only. You can help with translating the documentation. In several cases, most of the translation is already done, and it only needs to be copied over to the relevant Wikipedia. If you are interested in finding out whether a particular Wikipedia is currently on the list, you can leave a message for me at my talk page.

For other questions or suggestions, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting problem reports at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and other ideas at Wikipedia talk:VisualEditor. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 21:54, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

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September 2013

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VisualEditor newsletter for September 19, 2013

VisualEditor has been updated twice in the last two weeks. As usual, what is now running on the English Wikipedia had a test run at Mediawiki during the previous week.

As announced, the toolbar was redesigned to be simpler, shorter, and to have the ability to have drop-down groups with descriptions. What you see now is the initial configuration and is expected to change in response to feedback from the English Wikipedia and other Wikipedias. The controls to add <u> (underline), <sub> (subscript), and <sup> (superscript), <s> (strikethrough) and <code> (computer code/monospace font) annotations to text are available to all users in the drop-down menu. At the moment, all but the most basic tools have been moved into a single drop-down menu, including the tools for inserting media, references, reference lists, and templates. The current location of all of the items in the toolbar is temporary, and your opinions about the best order are needed! Please offer suggestions at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback/Toolbar.

In an eagerly anticipated upgrade to the reference dialog, newly added references or reference groups no longer need the page to be saved before they can be re-used (bugs 51689 and 52000). The 'Use existing reference' button is now disabled on pages which don't yet have any references (bug 51848). The template parameter filter in the transclusion dialog now searches both parameter name and label (bug 51670).

In response to several requests, there are some new keyboard shortcuts. You can now set the block/paragraph formatting from the keyboard: Ctrl+0 sets a block as a regular paragraph; Ctrl+1 up to Ctrl+6 sets it as a Heading 1 ("Page title") to Heading 6 ("Sub-heading 4"); Ctrl+7 sets it as pre-formatted (bug 33512). Ctrl+2, which creates level 2 section headings, may be the most useful.

Some improvements were made to capitalization for links, so typing in "iPhone" will offer a link to "iPhone" as well as "IPhone" (bug 50452).

Copying and pasting within the same document should work better as of today's update, as should copying from VisualEditor into a third-party application (bug 53364, bug 52271, bug 52460). Work on copying and pasting between VisualEditor instances (for example, between two articles) and retaining formatting when copying from an external source into VisualEditor is progressing.

Major improvements to editing with input method editors (IMEs; mostly used for Indic and East Asian languages) are being deployed today. This is a complex change, so it may produce unexpected errors. On a related point, the names of languages listed in the "languages" (langlinks) panel in the Page settings dialog now display as RTL when appropriate (bug 53503).

Looking ahead: The help/'beta' menu will soon expose the build number next to the "Leave feedback" link, so users can give more specific reports about issues they encounter (bug 53050). This change will make it easier for developers to identify any cacheing issues, once it starts reporting the build number (currently, it says "Version false"). Also, inserting a link, reference or media file will put the cursor after the new content again (bug 53560). Next week’s update will likely improve how dropdowns and other selection menus behave when they do not fit on the screen, with things scrolling so the selected item is always in view.

If you are active at other Wikipedias, the next group of Wikipedias to have VisualEditor offered to all users is being finalized. About two dozen Wikipedias are on the list for Tuesday, September 24 for logged-in users only, and on Monday, September 30 for unregistered editors. You can help with translating the documentation. In several cases, most of the translation is already done, and it only needs to be copied over to the relevant Wikipedia. If you are interested in finding out whether a particular Wikipedia is currently on the list, you can leave a message for me at my talk page.

For other questions or suggestions, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting problem reports at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and other ideas at Wikipedia talk:VisualEditor. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 22:00, 19 September 2013 (UTC)

Publicity

I've just had cause to count up the number of images in Wikimedia of Bentley cars built in the new millennium, there are six hundred and forty-nine, 649. Thank you for your recent contributions to Wikimedia and may there be many more. Regards, Eddaido (talk) 23:32, 21 September 2013 (UTC)

Still a bit breathless from driving over to the Netherlands yesterday to collect a couple of beds, but nice to come back to your kind encouragement. And thank you (as before) for noticing! I'd noticed you busily categorising, and indeed found myself moved by that to look again at some of "my" Bentley pix recently. Rather satisfying where they are good, though that sounds a tad smug, and none is perfect. That red on a green background Flying Spur you recategorised yesterday(?) would have been so much better as a picture if the angle had been just slightly different. The angle of the slope on the field where they hold that oldtimer show is good for interesting angles but also ... um ... challenging. Incidently, the Previa behaved impeccably on the bed collecting trip so maybe now we've splashed out on a THIRD replacement turbo he will become a reliable car for a few years. I do hope so. Regards Charles01 (talk) 07:41, 22 September 2013 (UTC)

He? Kittybrewster ☎ 07:54, 22 September 2013 (UTC)

Hmmm, no, I think that's a typo. Wouldn't the masculine be Previous and that would suggest a poor prior (turbo) record. Sorry, when I started it that line of thinking seemed like a good idea. I'm a bit addled by a more than week-long effort to load up some images generously released by a Dutch Bentley enthusiast, some of which you have noted above. Might there be a link between his generosity and your trip? If so many thanks to you too. I still think Toyota do a good job when making their vehicles but having to rely on Third Time Lucky is not good and I hope they have given a long warranty. Best, Eddaido (talk) 10:13, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

Now I understand the reference to "He?" which till now I hadn't. Yes, I suppose using "he" as a pronoun (rather than "it") in that context is indeed a direct translation from the Dutch, though I wasn't aware of it till between the two of you you explained. I don't think the Dutch Bentley enthusiast is anything to do with me, though there is a guy who I guess is most likely Dutch, unless Flemish, called Alfvanbeem who has over several years uploaded a lot of excellent pictures of cars. If he has uploaded a lot of Bentley shots lately, good.

I'm still feeling cautiously affectionate towards the Previa at the moment. The first turbo replacement came just before the expiry of the (3 year) warranty (although by then "he"'d dumped us ingloriously by the roadside a couple of times already in what I think must have been turbo - or possibly fuel feed valve - related issues) but this time it was more than 4 years, so hooorray that the second turbo lasted four years, but still cause for resentment that it didn't last as long as the car (should) and that I had to pay an extra couple of thousand on repairs for which I had not budgeted. Anyhow, all this is a bit outside wiki scope. Happy days. Charles01 (talk) 10:41, 27 September 2013 (UTC)