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Wikipedia:Requested moves/Technical requests

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Robertsky (talk | contribs) at 12:18, 1 November 2024 (Handled 1 request: Removed Pablo Escobar, The Drug Lord as contested (via script)). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

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If you are unable to complete a move for technical reasons, you can request technical help below. This is the correct method if you tried to move a page, but you got an error message saying something like "You do not have permission to move this page, for the following reasons:..." or "The/This page could not be moved, for the following reason:..."

  • To list a technical request: edit the Uncontroversial technical requests subsection and insert the following code at the bottom of the list, filling in pages and reason: 
    {{subst:RMassist|current page title|new title|reason=edit summary for the move}}
    This will automatically insert a bullet and include your signature. Please do not edit the article's talk page.
  • If you object to a proposal listed in the uncontroversial technical requests section, please move the request to the Contested technical requests section, append a note on the request elaborating on why, and sign with ~~~~. Consider pinging the requester to let them know about the objection.
  • If your technical request is contested, or if a contested request is left untouched without reply, create a requested move on the article talk and remove the request from the section here. The fastest and easiest way is to click the "discuss" button at the request, save the talk page, and remove the entry on this page.
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Technical requests

Edit this section if you want to move a request between sections.

Uncontroversial technical requests

Most requests should be placed below this heading.
  • Dipturus natis (currently a redirect to Blue skate) → Dipturus batis (currently a redirect instead to Blue skate) (move · discuss) – Cocked this up, I moved this page to Dipturus flossada as common skate is the name of the species complex including this species, the blue skate, and flapper skate. EcoF still lists it as D. batis Blue skate is amibiguous so the name for the article should be Dipturus batis. Although there is a proposal at or going to the ICZN to have this changed to Dipturus flossada. Quetzal1964 (talk) 10:32, 1 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Amaan Ali Khan → Amaan Ali Bangash (currently a redirect back to Amaan Ali Khan) (move · discuss) – name inconsistent, see credit used Hekerui (talk) 17:45, 28 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
More info may be needed here. This musician and his brother both have articles: Amaan Ali Khan (this one) and Ayaan Ali Khan, but the text in the two articles use "Khan" and "Bangash" in haphazard ways so it's tough to decipher birth names, stage names, matronyms, patronyms, or whichever is more relevant. Also, if this request is granted we may have to do the same for his brother too. ---DOOMSDAYER520 (TALK|CONTRIBS) 12:57, 29 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Requests to revert undiscussed moves

If your request involves reverting a move, place it here.

Contested technical requests

Do not insert new requests in this section. Only move requests here if the requested move has been contested.
@Jean-de-Nivelle It appears that Bedroom farce has about twice the pageviews of the play, so more likely, the alternative capitalization of Bedroom Farce should redirect to Bedroom farce instead. Raladic (talk) 21:27, 27 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Raladic That's a good point, but wikinav analysis ([1][2]) shows that only 13% of "Bedroom farce"'s traffic is from search results, the majority coming from internal links, while over 60% of "Bedroom Farce (play)"'s traffic is from "other search" - if I'm interpreting the results correctly. Worth an RM, or would WP:RFD be a better course? Jean-de-Nivelle (talk) 10:57, 28 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Since I believe you'd still like to move Bedroom Farce (play) to Bedroom Farce, I'd say a RM is probably best to answer both the question of if it should be moved, or if not, if Bedroom Farce should instead redirect to Bedroom farce as a redirect from alternative capitalization and then just post a note at the lowercase article to let people watching that article know about the RM. Raladic (talk) 00:19, 29 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Since there seems to be debate over which of the two topics is PTOPIC, and it's been flipped over the years, I'd say it's likely there isn't one, so I've just made Bedroom Farce a disambiguation page. This will have the additional benefit that if people link to the wrong one then they'll get a warning.  — Amakuru (talk) 21:07, 30 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • The Mexican → The Mexican (film) (currently a redirect back to The Mexican) (move · discuss) – The title should clarify that this is a film as per WP:PARENDIS. According to WP standards, parenthetical disambiguation is needed because the standard use of Mexican is not for a film, but a person from Mexico. Currently, there is a backward redirect MexFin (talk) 06:22, 28 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Currently the 2001 film is set as the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC for the term The Mexican, which seems reasonable as it has a large lead in page views over the other four topics from the Mexican disambiguation page which are called The Mexican. I'm guessing the OP is suggesting perhaps the generic use of Mexican as defined by the other usages on that disambiguation page should be considered for The Mexican too, but we don't normally regard such titles as ambiguous if there's a clear primary topic for the exact term as specified. @MexFin: please start a full RM discussion if you wish to proceed. Thanks  — Amakuru (talk) 11:15, 28 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Partial disambiguation of films is never uncontroversial. "The Mexican" is not the same as "Mexican". —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 23:31, 29 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Thyia of Thessaly (currently a redirect to Thyia (daughter of Deucalion)) → Thyia (daughter of Deucalion) (move · discuss) – No sources call her "Thyia of Thessaly". Best to use the disambiguator "daughter of Deucalion", per sources such as Gantz's Early Greek Myth, p. 909, and Hard's Routledge Handbook of Greek Mythology, p. 741. Michael Aurel (talk) 14:35, 28 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    This is just standard naming for princesses and suchlike - <Name> of <Location>. I don't see a strong need to change it and the current tittle is WP:NATURALDIS.  — Amakuru (talk) 15:23, 28 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I'm not aware of any source calling her a princess, so I don't know why we would use standard naming for royalty. Her only real significance is genealogical. In addition, as I said, I don't think there is any source which calls her "Thyia of Thessaly", so I don't see how WP:NATDIS applies, since the phrase is not what she is commonly called in English reliable sources. – Michael Aurel (talk) 17:05, 28 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Maybe what I meant when I said [h]er only real significance is genealogical will be made clearer if I specify that this figure is only mentioned in two ancient texts: Hesiod's Catalogue of Women, [3] which only says that she is the daughter of Deucalion and the mother, by Zeus, of Macedon and Magnes, and Stephanus of Byzantium's Ethnica, [4] which pretty much says the exact same thing, almost word for word. Secondary sources don't say anything more than this (there isn't anything more to say). – Michael Aurel (talk) 03:05, 31 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • FWD Tower → PCP Tower (move · discuss) – The building in question is actually known as Pacific Century Place. As written on the official website https://pcp-jakarta.com there is no record of the building ever being referred to as FWD Tower. This incorrect information is misleading and could cause confusion among users. Andres Arie Wibowo (talk) 09:26, 29 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    You say "PCP Tower" is the proper name but the article itself and sources you mention make no mention of "Tower"... they say either "Pacific Century Place" or "PCP Jakarta". Keep in mind Pacific Century Place Marunouchi also exists so maybe "Pacific Century Place Jakarta" is the best option and then Pacific Century Place as a disambiguation page; either way this should probably go to an RM. RachelTensions (talk) 14:48, 29 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Andres Arie Wibowo There seems to be a reasonably large amount of RS calling it the "FWD tower", so this should probably be discussed in a full RM. Even the indonesian Wikipedia has had this as the name for many also known as names until some user decided to quietly change it. We go by what is the WP:COMMONNAME for article titles, this may not always be what the "official name" is for a place. Raladic (talk) 14:50, 29 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Ghafeli Usage of the term appears to be inconsistent in other sources, often used without the stylized K. We generally use sentence case for article titles, but we can create a redirect from the other one. Raladic (talk) 00:52, 31 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Jews in Madagascar (currently a redirect to History of the Jews in Madagascar) → History of the Jews in Madagascar (move · discuss) – For over two decades on WP all articles about Jews in countries and in other areas, whether from ten, or a hundred, or a thousand years ago, has been titled as "History of the Jews in ____", see over 150 examples of this in Category:Jewish history by country (as well as in Category: Jewish history by city etc etc.) The only times that an article is reduced to the topic of a type of Jew is when writing about sub-groups within Jews themselves, such as Ashkenazi Jews, Sephardic Jews, Mizrahi Jews, which has nothing to do with the countries they are in per se. These articles record the Jewish history of Jews, all kinds of Jews, in any country or region regardless of how long those Jews have existed or been recorded there or what types of Jews they are, whether "imported" or "home-grown" it makes no difference, they are part of the "History of the Jews in ____" series of articles on WP. See Talk:Jews in Madagascar#Requested move 31 May 2024 where @Zanahary: made up a new set of "criteria" and moved the article/s without major WP:CONSENSUS from other editors, based on all sorts of unfounded and fanciful reasons such as "conciseness" and "Jews as foreigners" that undermined the original connection of these articles to the main scholarly subject of Jewish history. IZAK (talk) 20:33, 31 October 2024 (UTC) IZAK (talk) 20:33, 31 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I oppose this move because the topic is best concisely and accurately named “Jews in Madagascar”. The article encompasses the history of ethnic and religious Jews in Madagascar, a contemporary community of indigenous converts to Judaism, and contemporary information about that community’s social situation in Madagascar. Also included is a lot of information on the Judaic origin myths and beliefs of Israelite origin in Madagascar, which is not the “History of the Jews in Madagascar”, but does fit much better under the topic of "Jews in Madagascar" as pertaining to beliefs about Jews in Madagascar (and definitely not their history, as no source treats these beliefs as historical). The sources also overwhelmingly do not frame the content of the article in context of history at all, let alone Jewish history.
    See Chinese people in Madagascar, Armenians in Lebanon, and Kurds in Iraq for examples of articles whose scopes are best summarized with their current shorter, broader titles.
    I’ll also note that reverting a undiscussed move, particularly one which ignores previous discussion and consensus, is totally standard and proper. ꧁Zanahary꧂ 22:24, 31 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Zanahary: I apologize if I can across as too vehement. I was expressing opposition to your own personal WP:POV that runs against a clear WP:CONSENSUS of hundreds of editors over two decades on WP who have stuck to naming articles about the Jewish history of countries and cities etc as "History of the Jews in ___" and NOT as you would like to have it "Jews in ___". Your so-called "consensus" is virtually non-existent because you took advantage of a limited number of articles (3 it seems) and had one or two editors agree with you that over-ran what has been the accepted norm for over 20 years on WP. I am truly alarmed and my fear is that you will use your own precedents to overthrow the existing order of all the articles on WP titled as "History of the Jews in ____" and change them to your POV outlook. By the way, you seem to be coming at this from the narrow point of view of sociology while all that is really included in the older field of plain old history. It does not matter what kind of Jews exist in Madagascar/Taiwan/Hong Kong because just as the History of Madagascar, History of Taiwan, History of Hong Kong are the grand all-inclusive topics for those countries' histories, so too is History of the Jews in Madagascar, History of the Jews in Taiwan, History of the Jews in Hong Kong the correct over-arching name for everything about Jews in those countries including all the types and things you mention about those Jews. IZAK (talk) 02:55, 1 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support the move as the content of the article is not just about a few Jewish people currently in Madagascar, but about the collective Jewish history of Madagascar. The existing title creates a clear misconception and the suggested move target is far clearer. With all due credit to the remarkable work by Zanahary in the tremendous expansion, the scope of the article and the details of theories of Jewish descent / connection to the Malagasy peoples is the clearest possible evidence that the scope goes far beyond a mere discussion of Jews in Madagascar; it is a history that deserves to be titled as such. Alansohn (talk) 00:35, 1 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    The theories of Jewish descent are not historical and not treated as historical by any source; they are regarded as an ethnic myth about Jews in Madagascar. ꧁Zanahary꧂ 00:39, 1 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Also, @Alansohn and @IZAK: What do you think about History of Jews in Madagascar? I don't see what the definite article adds, and I find it potentially misleading. I still oppose the move, but I find History of Jews in Madagascar much better than History of the Jews in Madagascar. ꧁Zanahary꧂ 00:46, 1 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Zanahary: The answer is NO, because there was already a decision with WP:CONSENSUS at Talk:History of the Jews in Abkhazia#Requested move 5 June 2020 to KEEP the name/s "History of the Jews in ___" and to NOT change them to "History of Jews in ____". IZAK (talk) 03:28, 1 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
New consensus can, of course, override old consensus, as this request is seeking to do. The moves in question were all done through discussions with consensus. ꧁Zanahary꧂ 03:32, 1 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Amakuru: That's a fair point. I hadn't considered the page views, although I suspect a lot of them are linking from Annaprashana (the more widely used name of the celebration). Request withdrawn. Gedrose (talk) 10:43, 1 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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