Talk:Ukraine bioweapons conspiracy theory

Question

According to the page, "In reality, the laboratories were first established to secure and dismantle the remnants of the Soviet biological weapons program". Yes, such claim appears in cited sources, but is it true? Which Ukrainian labs were ever involved in the Soviet biological weapons program? I do not know any. There were a number of facilities, and they appear in Soviet_biological_weapons_program#List_of_Soviet/Russian_biological_weapons_institutions,_programs_and_projects, but none of them was on the Ukrainian territory. There is nothing in sources like [1]. My very best wishes (talk) 16:57, 24 March 2022 (UTC)

I checked this, and again, nothing about any remnants of Soviet biological weapons program and nothing about "new labs" except a few mobile labs to prevent COVID. My very best wishes (talk) 17:26, 24 March 2022 (UTC)

Good point, and helpful to try to minimize misunderstandings in a conspiracy theory article. There's a bit more info on this part in these cited sources in the "Connection to previous conspiracy theories" section. Daily Beast Foreign Policy Coda Story. Also Coda Story again not yet cited. From reading, it does seem like none of the labs that were in the Soviet biological weapons program were in Ukraine itself, none have been mentioned by the articles written so far. The only one that journalists have mentioned as a "new" laboratory built to destroy remnants of the Soviet program was Lugar Research Center in Georgia not Ukraine. However previous conspiracy theories spread disinformation against that health facility, so it is mentioned frequently regarding the "Ukraine biolabs" conspiracy theory by journalists debunking it. -- Rauisuchian (talk) 01:49, 25 March 2022 (UTC)

So, basically, no one named specific labs where something nefarious could occur. Sure, some labs in Ukraine just studied pathogens (I also saw a story about lab in Kharkiv that studied bats), but none of this has anything to do with bioweapons, right now or in the past... We do not even have a page Ukraine and weapons of mass destruction. We do have Nuclear weapons and Ukraine. My very best wishes (talk) 03:02, 25 March 2022 (UTC)

Correct. So, here are potential additional details added to the middle of that paragraph, 1) name of the program, 2) that only ones outside Ukraine are noted as previously being involved in destroying remnants of Soviet program to have ever had in the first place (only one is ever mentioned by sources but they say plural), 3) that the Ukraine threat reduction labs and their work are so public/international that they send academics to international science conferences. May condense this somehow.

In reality, the Ukrainian Ministry of Health and the U.S. Department of Defense signed an agreement in 2005 to prevent the spread of technologies and pathogens that might be used in the development of biological weapons, as part of the Biological Threat Reduction Program. In Ukraine, old public health facilities were refurbished with Ukrainian state funds. Outside Ukraine, and with international partnerships, new laboratories were established to secure and dismantle the remnants of the Soviet biological weapons program, and since then have been used to monitor and prevent new epidemics. The laboratories are publicly listed, not secret, and are owned and operated by host countries such as Ukraine, not by the US. The Ukrainian-owned threat reduction labs, which are listed by the US Embassy, also send academics to international scientific conferences.

There is some duplicated detail with the last section "Connection to previous conspiracies" (second paragraph). May merge these but kind of need the two explanations because of the way sources bring it up. I think, the Snopes article gives the best overall overview that we can follow to organize the debunking section. -- Rauisuchian (talk) 09:44, 26 March 2022 (UTC)

Sources

Requested move 13 June 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved (non-admin closure) >>> Extorc.talk 04:13, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

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Ukraine biolabs conspiracy theory → Ukraine bioweapons conspiracy theory – The current title of this article implies that the conspiracy theory is about the biolabs themselves, and not the allegation that they were developing biological weapons. MiasmaEternal☎ 05:36, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

• Support  How about Ukraine biological weapons conspiracy theory, to support the WP:CRITERION of consistency? Only one article includes the contraction[2] but several use the (more familiar?) long form[3]. —Michael Z. 19:31, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

  I considered that title, but decided against it due to brevity. I definitely like your reasoning, though. MiasmaEternal☎ 07:16, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

• Support as it is a more accurate title of the article. - Amigao (talk) 14:23, 18 June 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Semi-protected edit request on 12 February 2023

It’s now been proven that these bio labs exist(ed). 70.114.238.140 (talk) 15:16, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 16:27, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

The State Department verified that there are labs, but that they are for defending against bio weapons, not for creating them. Perhaps this article should mention it? Fnordware (talk) 00:57, 16 August 2023 (UTC)