Template talk:Timelines of Chinese history
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Inclusion of Singapore in Template:Timelines of Chinese history
[edit]Qiushufang has included Singapore in the above-mentioned template and dropped the template in Timeline of Singaporean history. His reason for inclusion is 'the template does not just include the history of the country of China, but also many related areas and topics - Singapore is today majority ethnically Chinese and more than fits the bill for inclusion in the template'. However, I disagree on the grounds that:
- Singapore is not a Chinese country or territory. The template is overwhelming China centric. Singapore is independent of China.
- If is to be included, it should be included as diaspora, and list with other countries with sizeable diaspora (i.e. USA) as well.
Even though Singapore has a large Chinese diaspora, Singapore has been separately managed and governed from China, even in ancient times. Whatever bearings China has on us would only be culturally and economically as international trade partners. Our political system, and societal structure, values are different. There were also relatively little events intertwining both nations. I seek consensus on whether to include Singapore in the above template. I don't think I would be able to resolve this with Qiushufang as looking at both our edit histories, we may end up clashing with each other over this. robertsky (talk) 06:08, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
- Hence why the template is not called Timeline of China, it's called Timelines of "Chinese" history. Are you really honestly going to reduce the fact that Singapore is majority Chinese to just "import" status? Does the history of Chinese people in Singapore not count as Chinese history? Qiushufang (talk) 06:13, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
@Qiushufang:, I totally agree with robertsky that Singapore Chinese community is a diaspora. Younger Singaporeans (Chinese, Malay, Indian and other races) have been moving away from their ancestral past and treat Singapore as their roots. The English word "Chinese" has many meanings, Cambridge dictionary explains it as "a person from China" while Collins dictionary explains it as "Chinese means relating to or belonging to China, or its people, languages, or culture". I would suggest that shifting Singapore from the Modern to Neighboring Countries of this template. At the same time, kindly remove this template from Timeline of Singaporean history and do not continue with the editing war. You can read more about more Chinese Singaporeans in the hyperlink.
- That seems fine to me, except I will probably make a section for diasporas later on and include it there instead rather than neighboring countries.Qiushufang (talk) 20:17, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
@Robertsky:, What do you think of my proposal? Kindly comment or correct me if any.Fiipchip (talk) 09:07, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
- I took some time off from this yesterday to cool off (otherwise, it would have been a strongly worded retort, blinded at the moment). Fiipchip yes, the proposal is good, but as with Qiushufang replied, put in a diaspora section can be a compromise as well. Qiushufang, thanks for having it removed and considering a section for diasporas. I will look for relevant articles, and hopefully these can be added in due time. robertsky (talk) 03:11, 22 August 2019 (UTC)
- Qiushufang's idea to create a new section could be a good thing. Anyway, I am glad that things are back to normal. Thank you to the both editors for your understandings as the two of you were that close to be banned due to war editing due to 3 revert rule. Fiipchip (talk) 04:08, 22 August 2019 (UTC)
- I took some time off from this yesterday to cool off (otherwise, it would have been a strongly worded retort, blinded at the moment). Fiipchip yes, the proposal is good, but as with Qiushufang replied, put in a diaspora section can be a compromise as well. Qiushufang, thanks for having it removed and considering a section for diasporas. I will look for relevant articles, and hopefully these can be added in due time. robertsky (talk) 03:11, 22 August 2019 (UTC)
(Invited by the bot) This is a near-tossup, I lean very slightly towards leaving it out. The common meaning of the title, and the common way that it will get interpreted is that "Chinese history" refers to China, not the Chinese people. And, in an area where many are not knowledgeable (the separateness of Singapore) presence in the template (for those who read no farther) could further their confusion by making it appear that Singapore is a part of China. Arguing in the reverse direction, I see little harm and some benefit in placing a link for such a very closely related topic. North8000 (talk) 11:44, 29 August 2019 (UTC)