Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2024 November 9

There is precedent to not have squad navboxes for teams that did not do well; none of the teams listed here have even made it out of the pool stage of the Rugby World Cup. Primefac (talk) 22:22, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nomination. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 16:53, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom.Tolozen (talk) 08:24, 11 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think, these templates should be kept. The final stage of the Rugby World Cup is the main event for national teams in rugby union, one tournament in four years, and participation (even without making playoffs) in the (final stage of) World Rugby Cup is itself worth commemorating with a template.-- Postoronniy-13 (talk) 20:40, 11 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Neil Breen

Template:Neil Breen (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

WP:NENAN, only three valid links. 3 other articles deleted and redirected. The Banner talk 21:00, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nomination. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 16:53, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom.Tolozen (talk) 08:24, 11 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Zolotonosha and similar Russia Ukraine navboxes

Template:Zolotonosha (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)
Template:Boryslav (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)
Template:Sheptytskyi (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)
Template:Smila (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Navbox with no transclusions and no (or too few) articles to navigate among. – Jonesey95 (talk) 14:50, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Jonesey95, what does Russia have to do with them? Are you geographically challenged? Aleksandr Grigoryev (talk) 15:14, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Beside the weird generalization, I think it makes sense to remove those templates and if such exists for Russia or any other country like, I don't know, Australia as well. Aleksandr Grigoryev (talk) 15:19, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  My mistake. Header corrected. – Jonesey95 (talk) 15:21, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nomination. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 16:53, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Puffery

Template:Puffery (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages) - only ~~402~~ 387 transclusions
Template:Promotional (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages) - 18104 transclusions

Propose merging Template:Puffery into Template:Promotional.

There seems to be little substantial difference between {{Puffery}}'s message ("This article contains wording that promotes the subject through exaggeration of unnoteworthy facts)" and that of {{Promotional}} ("This article contains promotional content"), to which it should be redirected. Reducing the number of similar templates decreases the cognitive load on editors, making it easier to know which to use. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 11:39, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Merge per nom ~ Tom.Reding (talk ⋅dgaf) 12:21, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge per nom Encoded Talk 💬 15:59, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge per nom. XtraJovial (talk • contribs) 19:54, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Given that in one case the puffery template involves ‘unnoteworthy facts, not something well-known but supporting the side of an interested party (as in conflict of interest, I would suggest that ‘puffery’ be treated as multiple issues, being both promotional and not meeting the criteria of WP: Notability 24.46.47.189 (talk) 00:22, 10 November 2024 (UTC)LeucineZipper[reply]
Oppose merge. There is a difference between the two. The first (i.e. {{Puffery}}) is that there are unnoteworthy facts that are taking up disproportionate amounts of emphasis or grandeur in the article. The second (i.e. {{promotional}}) is used as a general tag to cover a wide variety of promotional items, which may or may not take the same form (for example, excessive outlinking to product sales websites could get the tag). For this reason, I oppose the merge. — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 03:40, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose merge. The difference between puffery and promotion is that with promotion, it may be true but just not neutral. With puffery, it's highly exaggerative and may not actually be true. Promotional is "XYZ is a highly effective product nominated for the ABC Award five times in a row." Puffery is "XYZ is the number one product for ABC! Nine out of ten doctors recommend it!" Puffery is a claim that is hard to source or back up but still gives the impression of importance and success to the viewer. Sirocco745 (talk) 10:10, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose merge because puffery may include overly detailed and possibly false information about a subject, while promotion, while true, is not neutral. Haruka Amaranth 10:35, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge. The slicing of very thin hairs above from the opposes. I don't think I've ever seen puffery actually used to mean something that wasn't also promotional. Izno (talk) 17:28, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It seems to me that there is a subtle difference between puffery and promotion, as described by Sirocco745, but {{Promotional}} and {{COI}} have a lot of overlap. Maybe there's scope for a merge there somehow. — Scott • talk 17:30, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
{{Promotional}} indicates a problem with the article itself, while {{COI}} indicates a problem with a contributor to the article—Template:Promotional/doc says This is not a {{COI}} tag. Decide whether to add the template based on the article's contents, and not based on your belief about who wrote the article. – Daℤyzzos (✉️ • 📤) 00:32, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that they are not the same. {{COI}} can be used where an article is unduly negative, or whitewashed of relevant negative content, as well as where it is promotional. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 17:40, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge. I agree with Scott on this one. It seems that Template:Promotional, Template:COI, and Template:Puffery have a massive amount of overlap between the three of them. Some amount of consolidation would be good. Tolozen (talk) 08:19, 11 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
COI has reason to be distinct since it has measurably separate policy to go along with it. Izno (talk) 00:07, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge per nomination. Achmad Rachmani (talk) 13:09, 11 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge to reduce complexity. Killarnee (talk) 22:06, 11 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge: readers don't need to know that it is the exaggeration of unnoteworthy facts creating a promotional tone, just that there is a promotional tone and they should take everything with a grain of salt. Editors also don't need to know to specifically look for exaggerated facts that need to be fixed, just a promotional tone (which would lead them to find those exaggerated facts). – Daℤyzzos (✉️ • 📤) 00:32, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge per nomination and Killarnee. Both templates convey that an article contains promotional language. It's unnecessary to inform the reader that an article contains language fitting such a specific nature. I'm not saying puffery isn't a category of promotional language, just that it's a limited and indistinct category that for Wikipedia's purposes doesn't need a distinction made for it. Adam8410 (talk) 03:51, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose: For some editors, seeing Template:Promotional in cases of WP:PUFF may confuse them if they do not find it "promotional" or if they can not distinguish between overtly promotional and puffed. Thanks, Please feel free to ping/mention -- User4edits (T) 06:27, 12 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Newspapers in Norway

Template:Newspapers in Norway (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

What is the point of this ugly clutter?. Norway has almost 300 newspapers, and I don't see any redeeming qualities in a navigation box between all of them – not to mention hundreds of defunct newspapers, which are unelegantly thrown into the mix as well. Geschichte (talk) 09:24, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. I find navboxes on newspapers for a specific country to be quite useful in navigating myself. I would advise removing the redlinks, and splitting off the defunct ones into their own part. PARAKANYAA (talk) 10:04, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep, rather big but certainly valid and useful. The Banner talk 21:03, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep I suggest trimming down the regional sections and dividing them up by national and local newspapers. Current format is just a lot of clutter. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 16:53, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per WP:NAVBOX #2, #3, #5. Izno (talk) 21:47, 11 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Public records laws in the United States

Template:Public records laws in the United States (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Unused with no mainspace article. Nothing connects other than the similarities of these laws. No real unifying topic presented. All articles are under Category:Freedom of information legislation in the United States. But no main article exists for this category so a navbox isn't necessary or needed. WikiCleanerMan (talk) 00:54, 26 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe the title should be changed to "Freedom of information laws in the United States"? Gonnym (talk) 09:35, 28 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 03:47, 2 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Izno (talk) 06:08, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Changing the title of the template won't do much as there is still no mainspace article for such a subject. It is also still unused. A third relist will not be necessary and still meets the criteria for deletion. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 16:53, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Nobody has agreed with you that this deserves deletion. That's why templates get relisted. Izno (talk) 17:27, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Show button

Template:Show button (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

This template is essentially unused these days with only some 2 dozen uses. Whatever it was used for before, it is no longer used for today. I suspect most uses today use CSS and additional divs to manage any weird leanings of content (such as {{navbox}} does). Izno (talk) 05:10, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nomination. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 16:53, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Template:WikiProject New York Jets

Template:WikiProject New York Jets (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

This is an inactive subproject of Wikipedia:WikiProject National Football League, not its own wikiproject. Task forces/subprojects/work groups whathaveyou are done through a parameter on the parent project template, not its own template. Should be merged with the parent project. edit: I meant to nominate this for merging not deletion. Apologies. PARAKANYAA (talk) 04:24, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Merge, replace and delete; Merge with Template:WikiProject National Football League, add |jets= to the template, replace usages and delete template. Gonnym (talk) 12:15, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nomination. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 16:53, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom, and sounds good to deal with it exactly as Gonnym describes.Tolozen (talk) 08:24, 11 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge to Template:WikiProject National Football League, per Gonnym. Ejgreen77 (talk) 09:15, 11 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]