Wikidata:Project chat/Archive/2024/08

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Data donation - initial questions

Hi Wikidata Community! I wanted to start a discussion about data donation and hopefully get some guidance on what's the best place to begin + what data would be most useful. I work with an open data Je suis rm (https://www.workwithdata.com/) and we have millions of datapoints, all from open data sources like the UN, World Bank, British Library, or Tate. We were thinking that it would be amazing to add our data to Wikidata to enrich it, especially as it all corresponds to existing items here and pages on Wikipedia. There is lots we would love to donate - data on countries' important economic & geographical metrics, books and authors, artists, politicians, etc. (all open data), but we were thinking that we could start with a smaller dataset such as artists (https://www.workwithdata.com/datasets/artists) to better understand how to match items and the relevant sitelinks. What do you think? Would love some direction and to learn how to go through all the data donation steps. AniaGrzybowska (talk) 09:49, 30 July 2024 (UTC)

I think it's better to import data from the original source. Sjoerd de Bruin (talk) 09:55, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
Hello, please see Wikidata:Data_donation M2k~dewiki (talk) 10:34, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
Thank you for the link! AniaGrzybowska (talk) 13:41, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
Yeah, I was thinking about doing that initially, but when we get all of the data from different sources, there are always differences and some missing values. We put together the sources about one item to get a more complete view, correct some incorrect or missing info in some sources and basically combine everything into datasets that cover what the UN says, plus what the World Banks says (and so on) to create an open data source that has all of those and put that into the public domain as well. I think it would be worth donating that as an additional point of reference! For example for artists, the MoMA says something different from Tate which says sth different from Rijksmuseum, etc. One museum usually misses some data which another one has (the date of death for an artist would be in MoMA's dataset but not in Tate's one). We clean up the typos, figure out the discrepancies in data formatting, check the individual datapoints. Quite similar to the World Bank actually, which also combines data from different agencies.
Thanks for the link as well! I came from that actually. It encourages to start a discussion first and figure out which data would be most useful with the community, so I came straight here. Should I then go ahead and try to prepare a data import on one dataset and go from there? I can do the artists. AniaGrzybowska (talk) 13:41, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
Also see
M2k~dewiki (talk) 13:50, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
Awesome, thank you! I'll read everything and get started on preparing the data. AniaGrzybowska (talk) 14:04, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
As your approach parallels that of WD, it might be an idea to do a SPARQL report for a set of artists and compare it with a WD set. It should be 90% in agreement, as we've probably used the same sources as you. Looking at the 10% will show if your quality control processes are superior to ours. If things look good, then we could look at using you as a reference to the facts we agree on for facts unreferenced here. Do you record for each fact where it came from, as you could pass through that information. Finally, new facts could be added to WD quoting your site, or better, the original site, as a reference. This might sound a lot of work, but if both sides are well structured, it should be automatable. Of course the reverse could be done, WD could be used to add to your datasets.
Having different projects working on the same thing introduces a refreshing set of alternative viewpoints. Vicarage (talk) 14:04, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
That's a really good point actually and it does sounds doable. We can see where all datapoints come from, so we will be able to spot-check what causes any differences between the data we have and what's already in WD. I'll test few data exports & imports to see how we can make that happen technically and we'll go from there. It might be a lot of work, yeah, but it'll be worth it in the end! We're working on something similar, but in the end we also want to contribute to the larger open data ecosystem, so adding what we have to WD and linking the sources is what it's all about.
What do you think is the best way to go about it? Once I compare the data and/or have a data import ready, would it be worth starting a new discussion here? AniaGrzybowska (talk) 15:39, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
It would be great to hear what the results of the data comparison are (either in this discussion, or a new one).
Specifically:
How many entities:
- Matched (exist in both datasets)
- Are new (and proposed for inclusion)
How many properties:
- Matched (exist in both datasets)
- Are new (and proposed for inclusion)
In both cases, would we able to enrich these existing items and new properties with their source references?
It would also be great to know how many discrepancies you uncover when matching existing items and properties.
Also, feel free to do a sample import of a handful of new items, where the community can help provide feedback on the structure. Iamcarbon (talk) 01:27, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

Datatype-change proposal

I would like to propose changing the data type of NIOSH Pocket Guide ID (P1931) to external identifier. The current data type is string. Janhrach (talk) 15:38, 22 July 2024 (UTC)

  • @Janhrach: At the time of the initial datatype conversions for external id's this property was listed as disputed due to the same id being applied to multiple items - "only 94.17% unique out of 720 uses". This should probably be cleaned up if it hasn't been in the meantime, or clarified in how the property should be used. ArthurPSmith (talk) 13:59, 23 July 2024 (UTC)
    @ArthurPSmith: The problem is that some IDs refer to groups of chemical entities, e.g. [1]. Is this a reason why P1931 couldn't have the external identifier data type? Janhrach (talk) 09:19, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
    If you want it to be an identifier then it should uniquely identify things. The ID for "Be and Be compounds" should not be applied to just Be or particular compounds, it is an identifier for the whole group. If we have an item for the whole group then the ID could be applied there. Or if you just want to have that link without it being really an identifier then string datatype is what you want. ArthurPSmith (talk) 13:03, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
    Thanks. Janhrach (talk) 08:05, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

described at URL (P973) and tekstowo.pl (Q126379084) again

Could someone make a batch to remove this spam from Wikidata so we can put the URL on the blacklist Trade (talk) 14:41, 1 August 2024 (UTC)

Most were added by a bot (User:Reinheitsgebot) using Mix'n'match; it has stopped and the Mix'n'match has been deleted. The links could be removed if there is consensus for that, but is there any reason links to the site should be removed and not made into a property just as AZLyrics.com artist ID (P7194) and other English-language sites are? Peter James (talk) 19:05, 1 August 2024 (UTC)
If there are already enough properties for lyrics (Wikidata:Property proposal/Tekstowo.pl artist ID) then Lyrics007 artist ID (P7206) could be deleted as according to https://www.isitdownrightnow.com/lyrics007.com.html "the site has been unreachable for more than 130 days". Peter James (talk) 19:11, 1 August 2024 (UTC)
If you wish Lyrics007 artist ID (P7206) to be deleted then you should request so. That have no bearing on this website.--Trade (talk) 05:20, 2 August 2024 (UTC)
At the same time if you wish to make a identifier proposal for tekstowo.pl the you are welcome to do so --Trade (talk) 05:21, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

@EncycloPetey, Huntster, Peter James, Lymantria:--Trade (talk) 05:23, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

ISBN-10 (P957) and ISBN-13 (P212) conflicts-with restriction on literary work and written work

Does this not defeat the whole point of the property? You can't use an ISBN property on books? And yes, I know that books can have many different ISBNs, but they can have many different identifiers, so this restriction makes the property basically useless. Yes I could hypothetically make a sub-item for every single edition the book has ever had digital or otherwise but that is not useful for linking purposes. Is this really how it's supposed to be done? PARAKANYAA (talk) 15:06, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

I agree with you, but the folks at Wikidata:WikiProject_Books are very keen on this approach, even for single edition books. Vicarage (talk) 15:20, 2 August 2024 (UTC)
That conflict is correct. ISBN values are assigned to specific editions of publications, not to literary works. There is no sensible way to assign an ISBN to Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone (Q43361) when there are hundreds of different editions and translations, each with their own ISBN values. For example Harry Potter and the Philosopher’s Stone (Q58242028) has an ISBN, because it is the 2014 paperback edition from the United Kingdom. And Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone (French edition) (Q58464836) has an ISBN because it is the 1998 French edition published by Éditions Gallimard. Each edition has its own ISBN value, so the ISBN is placed on the data item for the specific edition to which it applies. We don't put it on the main item for the literary work, because that would lead to multiple conflicting ISBN values on a data item. And each of those editions has its own publisher, publication date, editor, language, place of publication, etc., and there needs to be a separate data item to tie all of that information together. The system adopted here is modelled on the international system used by libraries to keep track of such things. --EncycloPetey (talk) 16:54, 2 August 2024 (UTC)
Well, I think that is dumb, but at least I know it's on purpose now. I'll just remove that property from works then PARAKANYAA (talk) 17:06, 2 August 2024 (UTC)
If you believe you can develop a superior system, I recommend writing it up and publishing in a journal of library science. The current system was developed through centuries of accumulated knowledge by hundreds of experts working together. But there is always the possibility someone will improve upon the current system. --EncycloPetey (talk) 19:23, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

Identical label and desc but no error?

Could someone figure out, how Wikidata system allows Qs:

Estopedist1 (talk) 16:24, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

There are Estonian articles for each and (based on machine translation to English) they appear to refer to different municipalities with the same name, or the same municipality that had parts in different historical administrative territories. It may be the case that the English labels and descriptions need to be updated to better distinguish them. William Graham (talk) 17:08, 2 August 2024 (UTC)
They both had their label and description changed on the same minute June 22 2024 to the same values, no idea why one of the edits wasn't rejected. William Graham (talk) 17:25, 2 August 2024 (UTC)
@William Graham: yep, Wikidata bug. I changed one value and now I cannot change it back. Thanks for commenting! Estopedist1 (talk) 20:03, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

Property proposal for person/lifespan

I'm attempting to create my very first property proposal (https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Property_proposal/lifespan), and have undoubtedly thoroughly messed it up, but hopefully not irretrievably. I wish to start recording as a property of certain persons, their lifespan as recorded on funerary monuments. E.g., so-and-so lived X years, Y months, and Z days. This requires, what appears to me, a data type not otherwise used in WikiData, namely a time duration. The existing Time data type merely represents a single point in time, and thus is not suitable here. For the moment, I've selected 'monolingual text' as the data type, with a regex constraining the allowed values (conforming to the ISO 8601 standard for such values). But I've no idea whether I've done any of this correctly. If someone more knowledgeable in how to craft property proposals could kindly critique my effort and offer suggestions on how to improve it, I would be most grateful. Thank you. Sarcanon (talk) 00:42, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

BTW, before anyone asks, the persons for which I will be adding this information will be from classical antiquity, and by convention, dates of birth and/or dates of death were never recorded, whereas the person's lifespan frequently was. Sarcanon (talk) 01:03, 3 August 2024 (UTC)
There's age of subject at event (P3629) which can be used as a qualifier on an unknown date of death. Ghouston (talk) 05:28, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

KUOW

KUOW (Q6339681) is just a separately licensed transmitter for KUOW-FM (Q6339679). No programming content of its own, really just a repeater. I suppose it still merits a separate item, but I suspect the two items should somehow be related to one another, which they seem not to be currently. - Jmabel (talk) 05:42, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

dementia (Q83030)

Please add [Overtreatment of diabetes in older people] to dementia risk factor list. See: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/39093563/. Thanks Nirts (talk) 07:26, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

"Default Values for All Languages" Feature - Share Your Feedback!

Hello,

Last week, we announced that a limited release of the “default values for all languages” feature—introducing the language code "mul" for labels and aliases—will soon be coming to Wikidata. We are currently working on improvements for “mul” in the Termbox on Item pages. We’ve already received feedback from some of you on the discussion pages, but we’d also love to hear from those who prefer to provide anonymous feedback.

Please share your thoughts on this 5-10 minute anonymous survey until August 4: https://wikimedia.sslsurvey.de/Wikidata-default-values-feedback.

If you have any questions or concerns feel free to let us know in this Phabricator ticket (phab:T356169)

Many thanks for your time. -Mohammed Abdulai (WMDE) (talk) 11:40, 29 July 2024 (UTC)

@Mohammed Abdulai (WMDE)It seems I can't use the search box to search for items that only have a default label (mul). See for instance Casey Szilvia (Q128347219). The search term 'Casey Szilvia' doesn't show item.
P.S. I also wrote this further down on this page. Sabelöga (talk) 20:54, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

OsiriX (Q1301762) and Category:OsiriX (Q21451891)

Hi. How does this works. Should they be merged or not? And if not perhaps someone can tell me why? MGA73 (talk) 15:18, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Q1301762 is the main item, Q21451891 is an instance of Wikimedia category (Q4167836) and exists to connect any categories to each other, and link them to the main item with the property category's main topic (P301). They shouldn't be merged, but if it only had a Commons category, that category could be moved to the main item and Q21451891 could be deleted (the Commons sitelink is in a category item if a separate item is necessary). I don't know if the Japanese Wikibooks category can also be moved, as other Wikibooks categories I checked were only connected to category items or were not in Wikidata. Peter James (talk) 15:48, 3 August 2024 (UTC)
Hello, only objects of the same type should be merged resp. connected to each other.
  • articles with same articles in various languages (including galleries on commons), describing the same entity (a person, a film, a geographical object, a taxon, ...)
  • categories with categories (including categories on commons)
  • disambiguation items with disambiguation items
  • family name items with family name items
  • firstname items with with first name items
  • lists items with list items
  • ...
The different objects can be cross-referenced (e.g. list related to category, main topic of the category, ...), so its easier to navigation. On Commons, the wikidata infobox shows the content of the item of the main topic when the commonscat is connected to a category item and the two items are cross-referenced.
Often, commonscats are directly connected to the item of main topic when there is no commonsgallery and not yet an item for the category.
M2k~dewiki (talk) 20:01, 3 August 2024 (UTC)
Also see Help:Merge M2k~dewiki (talk) 20:04, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Searching for default labels (mul)

It seems I can't use the search box to search for items that only have a default label (mul). See for instance Casey Szilvia (Q128347219). The search term 'Casey Szilvia' doesn't show the item. Sabelöga (talk) 20:53, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Also see Help:Default_values_for_labels_and_aliases#Where_can_I_report_problems? -> Help_talk:Default_values_for_labels_and_aliases#Searching_for_default_labels_(mul) M2k~dewiki (talk) 19:35, 4 August 2024 (UTC)

Additional languages cluttering suggestions

No doubt this is supposed to be helpful, but it is not. When attempting to type in a field, I don't need Finnish or Spanish suggestions showing up alongside English. Disable it immediately. Abductive (talk) 08:12, 4 August 2024 (UTC)

Non-unique statement id in Q85046372

According to Wikidata documentation: [stmt_id is] An arbitrary identifier for the Statement, which is unique across the repository.

But going to the Wikidata webpage for Secondary limb lymphedema (Q85046372) and looking in the page source, we can see that Q85046372$70E829CD-2D80-48D1-BB71-8EE2B5C22051 is referenced twice, every time with a different underlying data: 

<div id="Q85046372$70E829CD-2D80-48D1-BB71-8EE2B5C22051" class="wikibase-statementview wikibase-statement-Q85046372$70E829CD-2D80-48D1-BB71-8EE2B5C22051 wb-normal">...</div>
...
<div id="Q85046372$70E829CD-2D80-48D1-BB71-8EE2B5C22051" class="wikibase-statementview wikibase-statement-Q85046372$70E829CD-2D80-48D1-BB71-8EE2B5C22051 wb-normal">...</div>

Both ids show up in cites work (P2860): Arm morbidity after sector resection and axillary dissection with or without postoperative radiotherapy in breast cancer stage I. Results from a randomised trial. Uppsala-Orebro Breast Cancer Study Group (Q73307092) and Case-control study to evaluate predictors of lymphedema after breast cancer surgery (Q37410695). 195.191.163.76 07:26, 26 July 2024 (UTC)

REST API response for the two P2860 statements with identical IDs:
curl -s https://www.wikidata.org/w/rest.php/wikibase/v0/entities/items/Q85046372 | jq '.statements.[].[] | select(.id == "Q85046372$70E829CD-2D80-48D1-BB71-8EE2B5C22051")'
JSON object from API response
{
  "id": "Q85046372$70E829CD-2D80-48D1-BB71-8EE2B5C22051",
  "rank": "normal",
  "qualifiers": [
    {
      "property": {
        "id": "P1545",
        "data-type": "string"
      },
      "value": {
        "type": "value",
        "content": "10"
      }
    },
    {
      "property": {
        "id": "P1545",
        "data-type": "string"
      },
      "value": {
        "type": "value",
        "content": "13"
      }
    }
  ],
  "references": [
    {
      "hash": "7c52980f6382f58bc9ff3831c60ec37b6e0618c0",
      "parts": [
        {
          "property": {
            "id": "P248",
            "data-type": "wikibase-item"
          },
          "value": {
            "type": "value",
            "content": "Q5188229"
          }
        },
        {
          "property": {
            "id": "P356",
            "data-type": "external-id"
          },
          "value": {
            "type": "value",
            "content": "10.1016/J.LPM.2009.06.023"
          }
        },
        {
          "property": {
            "id": "P854",
            "data-type": "url"
          },
          "value": {
            "type": "value",
            "content": "https://api.crossref.org/works/10.1016/J.LPM.2009.06.023"
          }
        },
        {
          "property": {
            "id": "P813",
            "data-type": "time"
          },
          "value": {
            "type": "value",
            "content": {
              "time": "+2024-07-15T00:00:00Z",
              "precision": 11,
              "calendarmodel": "http://www.wikidata.org/entity/Q1985727"
            }
          }
        }
      ]
    }
  ],
  "property": {
    "id": "P2860",
    "data-type": "wikibase-item"
  },
  "value": {
    "type": "value",
    "content": "Q73307092"
  }
}
{
  "id": "Q85046372$70E829CD-2D80-48D1-BB71-8EE2B5C22051",
  "rank": "normal",
  "qualifiers": [],
  "references": [],
  "property": {
    "id": "P2860",
    "data-type": "wikibase-item"
  },
  "value": {
    "type": "value",
    "content": "Q37410695"
  }
}
--Dhx1 (talk) 13:44, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
You might want to repost this at Wikidata:Report a technical problem or open a Phabricator ticket. @Mohammed Abdulai (WMDE) is always very helpful. William Graham (talk) 16:31, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
reposted it in Report a technical problem 195.191.163.76 11:52, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
Apologies for the late response; I was out of the office. I've seen your message and will leave feedback at WD:RATP -Mohammed Abdulai (WMDE) (talk) 08:37, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

Circa

How to add note to value for population (P1082) if value is circa (Q5727902). Eurohunter (talk) 23:26, 4 August 2024 (UTC)

Can you give the specific instance you're planning on using? E.g. if it was c. 1709, then you could use "1700s" and just have that level of precision. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 23:43, 4 August 2024 (UTC)
@Koavf: population (P1082) has value 8500 but how to indicate that it's circa (Q5727902) (more or less than 8500). Eurohunter (talk) 23:50, 4 August 2024 (UTC)
Sorry, I misunderstood. You can add sourcing circumstances (P1480) with circa (Q5727902). —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 23:59, 4 August 2024 (UTC)
circa (Q5727902) must only be used for dates. For numbers, you should use approximately (Q60070514). Ayack (talk) 09:44, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
@koavf:, @Ayack: Thanks, done. Eurohunter (talk) 12:11, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

Wikidata weekly summary #639

Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week.
This is the Wikidata summary of the week before 2024-08-05. Please help Translate.

Discussions

  • New requests for permissions/Bot:
    • Numberguy6Bot - Task: Add links to Wiktionary categories in English, Spanish, French, Portuguese, and Russian.
    • UmisBot - Task: This bot will add string representations of units of measurement to units of measurement Wikidata pages.
    • ZLBot - Task: request SPARQLs for RAG.

Events

  • Next Linked Data for Libraries LD4 Wikidata Affinity Group call 6 August, 2024: We have our next LD4 Wikidata Affinity Group Call on Tuesday, 6 August, 2024 at 9am PT / 12pm ET / 17:00 UTC / 6pm CET (Time zone converter). Please join us for a Busy Summer Fun Wikidata Editing Hour, an hour of uninterrupted Wikidata editing time to work on your own Wikidata projects. Agenda.
  • Wikimania is August 7-10. Here is a curated a list of Wikimania sessions focused around Wikidata, or have *some* connection to Wikidata: 2024:Program/Wikidata. Please add to the list if something is missing.

Press, articles, blog posts, videos

Tool of the week

  • Forage - a user script that provides an additional editing interface that makes editing easier, by showing the expected properties for a page (based on its "instance of" values), and providing simple inputs to let users add values for any such property. To install Forage, just add the following line to the common.js subpage under your user page on Wikidata, i.e. wikidata.org/wiki/User:Your username here/common.js: importScript('User:Techwizzie/forage.js');

Other Noteworthy Stuff

  • The Wikibase REST API, introduced last year on Wikidata, is progressing towards version 1, aiming for a comprehensive release by the end of 2024. We're seeking community feedback to enhance the current API and plan future developments. Please share your thoughts on this page: Feedback on the Wikibase REST API (July/August 2024).
  • Abdulai Yorli Iddrisu (WMDE) has joined the Software Communication team (SCoT) at Wikimedia Deutschland as an intern until the end of September 2024. Welcome Yorli!
  • Wikidata now has a shiny new landing page for developers: Wikidata:For developers

Newest properties and property proposals to review

You can comment on all open property proposals!

Did you know?

Development

  • mul language code: The new language code has been rolled out in a limited way. We are looking through feedback now.
  • mul release: The full release of the "mul" language code feature to Wikidata, originally scheduled for August 12, may be delayed as we have uncovered a few issues during testing that could potentially block the scheduled release.

You can see all open tickets related to Wikidata here. If you want to help, you can also have a look at the tasks needing a volunteer.

Weekly Tasks

population (P1082)

Need to use population (P1082) as qualifier (Q54828449). Is there any other option to use, or it needs to be added to exceptions? Eurohunter (talk) 19:35, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

There are two values for population (P1082) newest and highest, and each of them has the own date. How to add them? Eurohunter (talk) 19:38, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
Use quantity (P1114). Make separate claims with different dates. Rank the newest data as preferred. --Matěj Suchánek (talk) 20:40, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

What to do with an item that seems to conflate two or more people

This item Jo Jo Smith (Q99646571) seems to conflate at least two people, a baseball player and a musician. What should one do here? StarTrekker (talk) 02:06, 29 July 2024 (UTC)

This is identical to the above: statements need to be moved from one item to another. Do you feel like you can tease out which statements and interwiki links apply to which person? —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 02:13, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
The item was based on https://id.worldcat.org/fast/405596/ for which the source seems to have been https://id.loc.gov/authorities/names/n97866648.html, but it looks like any identifier with a matching name was added. There are three people: baseball player Joseph Edward Smith (Baseball Cube player ID and Trading Card Database person ID), a musician (Discogs 4903638 and Australian Women's Register), and jazz dancer Joseph Benjamin Smith (the other identifiers; probably the intended subject). I couldn't find existing items for any of these three, but when searching I found another conflation: Joseph Edward Smith (Q105395287). Peter James (talk) 16:11, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
See Help:Conflation of two people. Best to create new items for all those people, move/copy statements to the appropriate new items and then nominate the conflation items for deletion. --2A02:810B:580:11D4:D861:7C54:F26A:7398

duplicates: Q56297769 can be merged into Q1121708

Q56297769 can be merged into Q1121708

If somebody can do this, I'd greatly appreciate and try to learn from it so I may do it myself next time :) TimBorgNetzWerk (talk) 12:41, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

@TimBorgNetzWerk: There is also breakdown (Q19977811). failure (Q56297769) is stated to be a subclass of failure (Q1121708) (as is breakdown (Q19977811) and several other items). These two at least do seem the same to me but evidently somebody in the past thought they were different (from the subclass relation). Perhaps it's due to historical wikilinks that are no longer an issue? There's a dewiki link on failure (Q56297769) and none on failure (Q1121708) so they could be merged now if we agree it's the right thing to do. ArthurPSmith (talk) 18:38, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
I believe failure (Q1121708) is the result of failure (Q56297769). Two different things. Failing is the state of failing. Failure is the result of failing. AHIOH (talk) 04:40, 6 August 2024 (UTC)
Interesting to see these changes. At least for me, now it seems (more) consistent. Thanks! TimBorgNetzWerk (talk) 12:59, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

Entries marked for deletion, what can I do?

I spend quite some time adding popular online marketing podcasts (see my contribution list) that are all in talk show format, episodes and prominent talk show guests and a lot of them now show inbound links from a "marked for deletion" list. From what I understand my entries miss sitelinks to match the notability guidelines. I am quite new to wikidata and don't understand how I can e.g. add the podcasts e.g to the list of german podcasts (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:German_podcasts) so they fullfill the requirements or what else to do. Can someone please advise how to handle this? It is quite frustrating to spend a lot of time adding stuff and than see it end up on a "marked for deletion" list. PodcastMage (talk) 19:22, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

See WD:N. "Sitelinks" means that the object has its own page on Wikipedia or another Wikimedia project, and it's unlikely that that will be true for these. So you should focus on criteria 2 and 3: either provide "serious and publicly available references" or show how it "fulfills a structural need". You should comment at the deletion request so that admins can judge whether notability is satisfied. Dogfennydd (talk) 22:57, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
Thank you for pointing this out. I commented on the deletion request. PodcastMage (talk) 05:42, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

Are museums buildings and tourist attractions?

I would say they are. But others argue at https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Talk:Q33506#Museums_need_the_properties_of_museum_building that a museum is a non-corporeal institution, not a building, and that 'materiality' is not required for a tourist attraction. I would argue that a museum, like a theatre, is a building I can visit, and while we can distinguish between museum_building and museum_institution, museum (Q33506), as currently used on WD, is both. Vicarage (talk) 13:56, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, in my opinion a museum (theater, company, school, ...) can
M2k~dewiki (talk) 15:11, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

Import etiquette Q

Hello, Wikidata novice but Wikipedia veteran here. At the UK Geography WikiProject we've been discussing the potential to import UK census population data into Wikidata and call it from the infobox that's used on articles about towns and villages, so it doesn't need manually maintaining on every page. I've been getting to grips with the project, I've watched the tutorials for OpenRefine, and I've got to the point where I'm pretty confident with how to do the import. I've got the population data for parishes in in England and Wales from the Office for National Statistics, I've matched them to their Q-items (using the ONS's GSS code (2011) (P836) to ensure correct matches) in OpenRefine, I've set up the schema and sense-checked the preview. But the OpenRefine interface warns me "Large edit batches should be submitted for bot review first."

So the question that I haven't been able to find answered anywhere in the help content is: what's a large edit? Or rather, what's the etiquette for batch edits generally? I've got 11,344 rows, each one adding (or updating, if the number is identical) a single population (P1082) (with reference) to a different UK town or village item (equivalent to this manual edit). If I hit upload on 11,344 properties, will people shout/frown at me? Do I need to get my batch bot reviewed? (Would I even be able to batch upload with OpenRefine, I assume my Wikipedia account confirmation status doesn't carry between project sites?) Thanks, Steinsky (talk) 14:08, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, according to
OpenRefine can use
for the upload, examples can be found at
There seem to be similar, comparable batches. M2k~dewiki (talk) 15:00, 6 August 2024 (UTC)
If the OP can use Quick Statements, then 11k items is not many, I've done 250k in batches, and it was easy to dribble them in at 1/second. No permissions needed, easy to check for errors. Vicarage (talk) 15:05, 6 August 2024 (UTC)
Great, thanks. I can see others doing similar batches in 'Recent changes', so I'll follow the be bold rule and set it running. Steinsky (talk) 15:08, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

Reminder! Vote closing soon to fill vacancies of the first U4C

You can find this message translated into additional languages on Meta-wiki. Please help translate to your language

Dear all,

The voting period for the Universal Code of Conduct Coordinating Committee (U4C) is closing soon. It is open through 10 August 2024. Read the information on the voting page on Meta-wiki to learn more about voting and voter eligibility. If you are eligible to vote and have not voted in this special election, it is important that you vote now.

Why should you vote? The U4C is a global group dedicated to providing an equitable and consistent implementation of the UCoC. Community input into the committee membership is critical to the success of the UCoC.

Please share this message with members of your community so they can participate as well.

In cooperation with the U4C,

-- Keegan (WMF) (talk) 15:29, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

Consider creating specific entries of Hades characters

(I posted this on the talk page of the Hades entry but didn't get responses). The entry on the video game Hades directly links to the Greek gods' entries (under the "Characters" property). We should consider creating entries specific to Hades characters and change the links to the Hades-specific entries, for consistency with entries of other media using derivative versions of characters. Draheinsunvale (talk) 13:12, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

I figured out that I can edit myself but I don't know if I can create a large amount of Hades-specific entries simultaneously to replace the current entries. Draheinsunvale (talk) 21:50, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
I will now edit the page to remove most of the character entries until the aforementioned specific entries exist. Draheinsunvale (talk) 12:31, 7 August 2024 (UTC)

Chronological order

My main interest on Wikidata is listed buildings. One of the things I do routinely is to change the instance of (P31) property from the generic architectural structure (Q811979) or building (Q41176) to the more specific house (Q3947) or school building (Q1244442) or whatever seems most applicable. But sometimes a building has had two or more uses over time: for example, a stately home that now houses a school. In such cases I add "house" with end time (Q24575125) set to "unknown" and "school building" with start time (Q24575110) also set to unknown (or to date values if they're available). However, it strikes me that this doesn't formally define the order in which these uses occurred. Should I also be setting series ordinal (P1545) or ranking (P1352) against each value to formally define the ordered life-history of the building (and if so, which)? There's an example at Sheffield High School for Girls (Q26682931). Thanks. Dave.Dunford (talk) 08:24, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

The dates should be sufficient, as SPARQL will sort by date. Ranking implies importance, and series ordinal implies no overlap. Using them in a few places will muddy queries elsewhere. PS I do prefer instance of (P31) over has use (P366) {{Vicarage (talk) 11:12, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
The problem is the dates when the use changed are usually unknown (at least without major research), but the order of use (e.g. "house, then school") is known and recorded in the listing. There generally isn't (in practice) an overlap, so maybe series ordinal is better? Dave.Dunford (talk) 16:20, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
A fort that becomes an art museum remains a fort, a church that becomes a museum, less so. But the ordinal doesn't affect that, so perhaps its the way to go. It certainly does no harm, unlike splitting the functionality of P31 and P366, which is a PITA for queries. A filter for ordinal >1 or missing would be handy for original purposes of buildings, and that would be useful. Vicarage (talk) 17:41, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
You could use instance of destroyed building or structure (Q19860854) or former building or structure (Q96084375), and then use replaced by. This allows you to apply the statements to the appropriate object and timeframes without conflating the data. This becomes particularly important when it comes to modelling the architects, builders, owners, historical designations, and so on. AHIOH (talk) 05:49, 6 August 2024 (UTC)
I guess I glossed over the main factor there of the building remaining. As the building has changed uses, the type of building in regards to its use changes as well. The building in regards to its form remains the same of course (it remains a subclass of that kind). It becomes an instance of a different class of object and therefore is still a replacement of the former entity or concept of the building as a whole. AHIOH (talk) 06:06, 6 August 2024 (UTC)
Individual buildings should use instance of (P31) and not subclass of (P279). Only a building raised to its foundations can really be considered destroyed, if remodelled its history should be recorded in a series of instance statements, not different items. I'm having a discussion at https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Talk:Q33506 as how we might handle museum institutions and their buildings, with a light touch so we don't need to double up entries. Vicarage (talk) 07:12, 6 August 2024 (UTC)
The issue with trying to model it that way is that it moves the data to the qualifiers. In OpenStreetMap there is a similar issue where modelling the history of an item with key values becomes problematic when it comes to determining whether the qualified data is transferrable or applies to which aspect of the object at a given point in time.
In practical terms, a school is one type of building and a library is another. A school and a library are two different things. When it changes functions, you say "it is now a library rather than a school.". The concept class changes. It is now an instance of former school. While you could model it as an instance of school and of library with start and end time qualifiers, this would mean that all characteristics of the item would by default apply to both instances at all times unless qualified with a particular time frame. This would also make it so associations would need to be scrutinized as to whether the one applies to the instance, the other or both (owners, organizations, members, etc.)
By modelling them as separate items it does not change the fact that they were still located at the same building. The data on the school item simply pertains to the concept of the building as a school during the time frame of its inception to when it ceased to function as a school institution. It then becomes an instance of former educational institution (Q96086516) and is replaced by (P1366) ("continues the item by replacing it in its role") by a different type of instance (library) with its own inception date and associated data.
This is similar to commercial entities that are merged into other companies. Once it transforms into a new concept of entity it is no longer an instance of the concept, but a former concept.
Trying do so otherwise would mean that all the companies that ever merged into another company would all be the same instance.
Consider a tree. If I convert it to firewood, is it still an instance of tree? Since it is no longer a valid concept of tree, it converts to an instance of firewood even though it is still a instance of type of wood.
The advantage to modeling it the way I described is that it makes it much more straightforward to associate the data to the correct concept and timeframe. It allows to model the reasons, causes, and effects related to the transformations of an entity from one concept to another. The transformation of the concept of an item can be mapped as its own data point as well such as "How many schools were replaced by libraries as a result of lack of teachers?"
Interesting topic, I'll try to read more into that talk you linked and look forward to your responses. AHIOH (talk) 01:58, 8 August 2024 (UTC)
We've had similar discussions with ships, with change of use or country for warships gets complicated. But having single items per hull seems best, and a ship's past is key to its present. Caveats by date get messy, so we use operator (P137) as a qualifier as an easy filter. I'm always wary of suggestions that splitting items is a solution to complexity, as then updates that should been applied twice often get missed. Vicarage (talk) 06:44, 8 August 2024 (UTC)
I see what you're saying . It's true the building itself as an instance of physical object does not intuitively make sense to be represented as separate instances as its physical form has not altered. As you mentioned, this would also create the issue of needing to copy the building properties among different instances of usage. I also realized my statement this "this would mean that all characteristics of the item would by default apply to both instances" was not really an issue. I forgot the operator (P137) property allows one to specify an organization which can then be qualified with a time frame as well as the other linked items rather than identifiers or values specific to the building. And as the organizations have a location/headquarters property, it allows the information on each to be separate while still linked. Thanks for helping change my mind, had to think through that one for a bit. @Vicarage AHIOH (talk) 16:50, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Project to support children with disabilities

How can i start a project to support children with disabilities?

Hello,

What's the correct way to handle dead links in official website (P856)? I've read through official website (P856)'s talk page and old project chats but not really found a concrete answer.

I'm working on Emma Lewell-Buck (Q16190712) and the listed address is dead. The correct one is `http://lewellbuck.com/` (from their English wikipedia page). UndefinedRachel (talk) 14:44, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

It's a mixed bag. (Some of the issues relate to how templates on various Wikipedia/Wikimedia projects consume the statements. Whether they interpret the start and end date qualifiers.) I think one of the more "correct" ways is to add a start date and end date qualifier for the previous URL, leaving it with a normal rank. Then create a statement for the current official URL with a start date qualifier and a preferred rank. William Graham (talk) 16:29, 8 August 2024 (UTC)
@UndefinedRachel: William got to the reply while I was making an example edit. Adding dates is great if you can find them, but they're not always apparent, even with archive.org. I've always seen the old website deprecated, but I suppose preferring the new site works too. My only concern would be a template or other end use interpreting a non-deprecated link as still valid. — Huntster (t @ c) 16:50, 8 August 2024 (UTC)
Agree. I'm of a mixed opinion of whether deprecated rank or preferred rank is better, but I have definitely done it your way in the past. In general, I've seen complaints on just about every viable model of dealing with old links, so I don't feel extremely strong about either. William Graham (talk) 17:02, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Edit request

Hi. Can anyone add آلباني from Gilaki Wikipedia (glkwiki) to Albania (Q222)? I don't have the permission. Mehrshad Mehdi pour (talk) 18:37, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

✓ Done

Q20712482

Ayahos (Q20712482) is some sort of weird conflation (which is messing up Commons via a Wikidata Infobox). It conflates a ferry terminal (on Commons) with a Native American "spirit power" on en-wiki. - Jmabel (talk) 01:51, 9 August 2024 (UTC)

en:Special:Diff/670436866 is the ultimate reason for the conflation. Not great Commons category – yeah, indeed. --Geohakkeri (talk) 10:07, 9 August 2024 (UTC)

Inconsistencies in the list of countries by continent

I try to list the sovereign state (Q3624078) included (has part(s) (P527)) in each continent (Q5107) with an ISO code (ISO 3166-1 alpha-3 code (P298)}).

See the query 

SELECT ?item ?itemLabel ?country ?countryLabel ?code WHERE {  ?item wdt:P31 wd:Q5107;    (wdt:P527*) ?country.  ?country wdt:P31 wd:Q3624078;    wdt:P298 ?code.  SERVICE wikibase:label { bd:serviceParam wikibase:language "en". } }
Try it!

I find many countries included to two different continents.

One source of error is do to the following statement: Africa (Q15)has part(s) (P527)Middle East (Q7204). This leads to the misleading consequence that Israel belongs to Africa. I propose to remove the statement.

Another problem is that France, Chili, and the United States are considered part of Oceania.

Finally, we have a problem with countries in Central America. They are considered to be part of both South America and North America.

How could we have a consistent list of countries by continent? PAC2 (talk) 12:51, 7 August 2024 (UTC)

More inconsistencies: Denmark and the Netherlands are missing (because the constituent countries are included in the continents, not the sovereign state), Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan and several countries in the Middle East are missing, Russia is included in Europe but not Asia, and there is no consistency with countries with limited recognition - Palestine and Taiwan are there, but Kosovo is not. Peter James (talk) 19:08, 7 August 2024 (UTC)
@Peter James You're right. It isn't always easy to find missing values.
I've written a small notebook to explore the data : https://observablehq.com/@pac02/list-of-countries-by-continent-in-wikidata.
How could we have consistent data for this simple query? is there any reliable source on this topic? PAC2 (talk) 21:17, 7 August 2024 (UTC)
Turkey and Russia do span continents. And lots of island chains are either of full status, like Tahiti and Hawaii, or a muddle of dependant territory rules. I think your query should expect to reflect that, use of preferred values won't help here. Vicarage (talk) 06:51, 8 August 2024 (UTC)
OK @Vicarage what would you suggest? PAC2 (talk) 14:08, 8 August 2024 (UTC)
Like pretty much anything to do with countries, the results you get will depend very heavily on how exactly you frame the question. The concepts of "country" and "continent" are both quite fuzzily defined, with significant differences between sources even on how many of each exist, never mind where their boundaries are, and in pretty much any permutation there will be many countries that span more than one continent. It's not particularly surprising that France would come back as being part of Oceania, for example, given French Polynesia (Q30971). (There's a difference between "All of France is in Oceania" and "Some of France is in Oceania"). Other permutations of the query would also show parts of France within Africa (Réunion (Q17070)), North America (Saint Pierre and Miquelon (Q34617)) and South America (French Guiana (Q3769)). If that's unexpected or unwanted, then you'll need to reword the question in a much more precise manner. Then if needed we can help express that in SPARQL and fix any errors or gaps in the underlying modelling or claims to make sure the various queries all get the correct answers. --Oravrattas (talk) 08:56, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

I don't understand what's the difference between these badges. "sitelink to redirect" description says "do not apply this badge manually; if you manually apply a badge you likely want to apply "intentional sitelink to redirects" instead". so "sitelink to redirect" is only for bots? if we add a wikilink that's actually a redirect we should use "intentional sitelink to redirect" instead? Did I understand that correctly? Why though? Or is it something else? The thing is, it's possible to add "sitelink to redirect" manually and I see users actually add that one, so what's the point? Tehonk (talk) 23:42, 9 August 2024 (UTC)

Good question. I was thinking the same and some items have both badges. Eurohunter (talk) 00:05, 10 August 2024 (UTC)
"intentional sitelink to redirect" is for humans, so that they can insert a link to a redirect, declaring the intention. In fact, this is the only possible way.
"sitelink to redirect" is indeed for bots. They cannot tell if the link intentionally links to a redirect or not, it's just an indicator for users who can deal with it. --Matěj Suchánek (talk) 09:40, 10 August 2024 (UTC)
I would probably add "sitelink to redirect" to an existing sitelink if I found a redirect and did not know if it was correct (if it could be a duplicate article or a redirect not relevant to the item). Peter James (talk) 10:39, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

How can I add a link from https://ru.wiktionary.org/wiki/*dailijaną to https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/dailijaną? This https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q127874798 doesn't work. ПростаРечь (talk) 21:25, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

Also see Wikidata:Wiktionary/Sitelinks M2k~dewiki (talk) 14:28, 11 August 2024 (UTC)

Lots of population statements

For a nearby municipality, official population count for each village is available online with monthly precision going back about 15 years. Is there anything wrong with adding ~200 statements per village to reflect that data? It seems "bad" in some way but I can't figure out any concrete problems. Uniwah (talk) 13:09, 11 August 2024 (UTC)

@Uniwah: Large items (with more statements) are slower to load, and there is a fixed limit on item size (which is usually reach at something like 5000 statements). But we do have a property specifically for this problem of lots of population data: tabular population (P4179) - the datasets go on Commons, with a link from the Wikidata item. ArthurPSmith (talk) 14:28, 12 August 2024 (UTC)

Wikidata weekly summary #640

Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week.
This is the Wikidata summary of the week before 2024-08-12. Please help Translate.

Events

  • Wikimania 2024 took place in Katowice, Poland. You can watch replays of the sessions on YouTube. Additionally, recordings of individual sessions are linked to each item on the Eventyay schedule.

Press, articles, blog posts, videos

Tool of the week

  • New Q5 - is a form that quickly sets up a Wikidata Item for an individual by generating a QuickStatement with the basic parameters such as name and age.
  • User:Nikki/SDCInfo.js - is a Userscript that shows some Wikimedia Commons statements on pronunciation audio statements on Lexeme forms.

Newest properties and property proposals to review

You can comment on all open property proposals!

Did you know?

Development

  • Not much happened this past week because the team was attending Wikimania.

You can see all open tickets related to Wikidata here. If you want to help, you can also have a look at the tasks needing a volunteer.

Weekly Tasks

QuickStatements Community Consultation

Hello, fellow Wikidata contributors!

QuickStatements has become an essential tool for many of us in the community, helping to streamline our contributions to Wikidata.

In light of the new developments around this tool, we want to hear from you about QuickStatements and where we can improve it.

For that, we've created a brief 19-question survey to gather your valuable insights on QuickStatements.

It will take just 15-20 minutes of your time and it will really help us refine the tool towards your needs and make it even more effective for everyone.

The survey will be open until August 31st.


Share your insights here!


Thank you in advance! EPorto (WMB) (talk) 19:20, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

Using low numbers for commonly used properties

Summary

Property:P6 is the only one of P1-P9 that currently exists. Since these numbers that are easy to type and remember, should we could move common properties to them or redirect them to the existing common property numbers?

Property history

P7 and P9 were deleted in 2016 and probably had substantial use. I don't think we should overwrite these any time soon.

P11 and P12 were deleted in 2013 with no substantial usage. (P11 log, discussion; P12 log, discussion). I'm inclined to overwrite these.

Suggested properties

I'd suggest the following properties:

  1. instance of (P31)
  2. subclass of (P279)
  3. part of (P361)
  4. has part(s) (P527)
  5. inception (P571)
  6. head of government (P6) (Already exists)
  7. P7 (P7) (Reserved from recent usage)
  8. dissolved, abolished or demolished date (P576)
  9. P9 (P9) (Reserved from recent usage)
  10. video (P10) (Already exists)
  11. start time (P580)
  12. end time (P582)
  13. publication date (P577)

I based this list on properties that I subjectively regard as basic, and prioritized items I thought most likely to be used by humans (as opposed to automated tools) in queries and manual entry.

One list of most frequently used properties is at Wikidata:Database reports/List of properties/Top100. It might be useful to compare another list which excludes properties used in references.

I offer this list to help illustrate my proposal, but I'd suggest we postpone discussing which properties to choose before answering the feasibility and desirability questions below.

Questions

  1. Is it possible there were uses of these low-numbered properties in Wikidata history that we should care about that aren't showing up in "Main public logs" at Special:Log?
  2. Is moving a highly-used property inherently a bad idea because it will increase server load due to increased redirects? (eg. redirecting P31 to P1) This will decrease over time.
  3. Is making a highly-used redirect inherently a bad idea because it will increase server load due to increased redirects? (eg. redirecting P1 to P31). This will continue perpetually.
  4. Do others think moving or redirecting would be good or bad for other reasons besides questions 2 and 3?
  5. Which is better, redirecting P31→P1 or P1→P31?
  6. Should we move or redirect over deleted properties that were never substantially used, eg. Property:P11? How much time should we give for existing uses to transition after deletion? (eg. 10 years)

Daask (talk) 18:58, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

It is a tremendously bad idea to repurpose deleted items or properties, regardless of the reasoning. Doing this would require millions and millions of changes to existing items. And furthermore, the item and property numbers aren't how most human interact with them -- instead they rely on the autocompletion of the labels and aliases. Your proposal seems to be a solution in search of a problem. I see no problem with the status quo. William Graham (talk) 20:36, 10 August 2024 (UTC)
@William Graham: Not repurposing answers question 6. "Millions and millions of changes" seems to oppose moving, but doesn't address creating redirects. As for what problem this solves: I often rely on my memory for common Wikidata property numbers for queries. Obviously, there are far more properties than can be memorized, so we do need user-friendly systems for searching for properties by label, but I thought having low numbers for the most common ones would make Wikidata more accessible to new users. Daask (talk) 12:34, 12 August 2024 (UTC)
 Strong oppose Creating redirects would make item histories nonsensical. There are a nontrivial number of historical (deleted) statements of deleted properties. If the Property number came back into existence then it would make it look like the value from the historical deleted statement applied to a completely different property. Also redirects in the property namespace will create scenarios where the results from Wikidata Query Service are missing results or provide unreliable results. Those are just some of the reason that your proposal is bad for data integrity and the useability of the knowledge base. William Graham (talk) 15:47, 12 August 2024 (UTC)
It certainly would be nice to have the most common properties at the low numbers that are much easier to memorize. And if we had to built the project again from the ground up, that would certainly be something that would be done. But after more than a decade into the project's existence, I think changes like that are simply not easily doable and would most likely have too many downsides and potential unintended side effects. --2A02:810B:580:11D4:68ED:8DC0:B68B:72FE 21:40, 10 August 2024 (UTC)
 Oppose I think everybody's going to have their own list of properties they'd like to be easier to enter, but really 2 characters vs 3 or even 5 is not a big deal. Plus most properties in my experience are just entered via autocomplete (or bots) where the property number is irrelevant. If I was to pick my priority properties it would probably be human-related ones like occupation (P106), employer (P108), affiliation (P1416) and some of the properties related to name (P2561). ArthurPSmith (talk) 14:21, 12 August 2024 (UTC)
Tech comment re 1 – my understanding is that in the early days of Wikibase, the list of reserved Entity IDs was shared between all Entity types, so P1–P5 never existed because Q1–Q5 were reserved (Universe (Q1), Earth (Q2), life (Q3), death (Q4), human (Q5)). Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE) (talk) 16:02, 12 August 2024 (UTC)
 Oppose – IMHO the justification for this proposal is pretty weak; I’ve previously argued (meta:Talk:Abstract Wikipedia/Reserved ZIDs#Spreading out numbers) that core Wikidata entity ID numbers not being consecutive or clustered in a small numeric range is actually a good thing. Lucas Werkmeister (talk) 16:05, 12 August 2024 (UTC)
I can never remember the number of family name (P734) because it's right next to given name (P735), so I strongly agree with this argument. —Xezbeth (talk) 06:31, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
 Oppose I see no good reason to re-number existing properties. And even if there were a reason, it would have to be a really good one to justify the technical problems that such a renumbering would cause. M2Ys4U (talk) 16:56, 12 August 2024 (UTC)
 Oppose no, please no! Multichill (talk) 16:32, 13 August 2024 (UTC)
 Oppose many people tent to remember something by its look or name. Changes like this, makes the environment to them unfriendly. --Juandev (talk) 07:20, 14 August 2024 (UTC)

Problematic items for Brazilian people

P31|Q5|S460|Q18382802

Some items for Brazilian people have wrong references

Each item has said to be the same as (P460) sex or gender (Q18382802) as their reference of instance of (P31) human (Q5)

I fixed some item such as Fabiana Andrade (Q10279109). Sharouser (talk) 15:56, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

We should fix these items and add citizenship information to them.
I think this is just bullshit. At least this is conflicting with human rights (Q8458) which might be the reason Brazil makes such silly laws. --Matthiasb (talk) 05:56, 14 August 2024 (UTC)

SELECT ?item ?reference WHERE { 

 ?item wdt:P31 wd:Q5 .
 ?item p:P31 [ prov:wasDerivedFrom [ pr:P460 ?reference ] ] .

}

I will fix them. Sharouser (talk) 11:41, 14 August 2024 (UTC)

made-for-TV film whose subsequent re-runs have been divided into seperate television series episodes

Do we have any items or properties that can be used to indicate this? And to indicate the relationship between the movie and the seperate episodes? Trade (talk) 17:48, 9 August 2024 (UTC)

Movie in question--Trade (talk) 17:48, 9 August 2024 (UTC)
Unfortunately, I don't think there's an established, documented way of modeling such editions (film cut into episodes, series cut into a movie, or movies that are sometimes released as one, two or more parts). Various such pilot movie items simply have has part(s) (P527) statements with the different episode items as values. But that doesn't really convey the exact nature of their relationship. Maybe edition or translation of (P629) and has edition or translation (P747) could be used. based on (P144) on the other hand is probably too generic, IMHO.
Tried to look up how this case is modeled on EIDR, but they simply list the three separate episodes and the film as just episodes of the show. And ISAN doesn't even have an entry for the film version, only the three episodes. So no help there, unfortunately. --2A02:810B:580:11D4:64A3:4ECC:9AC4:295B 21:26, 10 August 2024 (UTC)
Why not use derivative work (P4969)? Trade (talk) 14:37, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Right, that would also a good candidate, didn't think of that. Though it kinda has the same "problem" as based on (P144), in that it is somewhat generic and doesn't necessarily fully convey the exact relation.
Though now I'm not even sure how we can properly model the details without creating items for the parts of the movie (like chapters of a book), and then use something like edition or translation of (P629) or derivative work (P4969) to connect those to the episode items. But that approach would probably be too detailed and also too cumbersome.
We also have the same problem (only parts of a work edited into a new work/edition) with other things like comics or literature published in serialized form.
Maybe we need a new property specifically to describe the exact relationships between individual works? Something like "relationship to other work" linking to the movie item, with qualifiers like "object has role" -> "movie cut into episodes" or "original work" + "subject has role" -> "episodic edit of a movie". That might even be useful for stuff like sequels, prequels, reboots or remakes that we also don't have a good way of modeling so far. --2A02:810B:580:11D4:B022:D696:BA14:90A3 00:31, 15 August 2024 (UTC)
I have now created television film later divided into television series episodes (Q129086536). Please suggest a better name or description because this isn't too great--Trade (talk) 14:38, 14 August 2024 (UTC)

How to describe printed work?

There is general term publication (Q732577) for any published, than physically printed work and printed book (Q11396303) is limited to just book. How to call any of such printed release of newspaper or any release looking like this? Eurohunter (talk) 19:28, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

@Eurohunter Do you mean periodical issue (Q21995230) ? Vojtěch Dostál (talk) 12:29, 8 August 2024 (UTC)
@Vojtěch Dostál: I don't think so. It don't indicate paper release. In case of music there are CD, vinyl or digital version, in case of books there is paper and digital version. Eurohunter (talk) 19:27, 8 August 2024 (UTC)
Do you want to model the specific exemplar or the fact that this newspaper was released via print? Uniwah (talk) 17:47, 11 August 2024 (UTC)
@Uniwah: Yes I want to model the fact that this newspaper was released via print. Eurohunter (talk) 07:44, 15 August 2024 (UTC)

Deleted qaulifier

Is this possible to find deleted qualifier by label? Eurohunter (talk) 07:43, 15 August 2024 (UTC)

Blue plaques

Hello folks - I've been considering how specific instances of blue plaque (Q885849) (used to commemorate notable people in the UK) should be represented on Wikidata. A few have been created as their own Q item (e.g. Annie Besant blue plaque (Q123737173), First Flying bomb on London fell here (blue plaque), Tower Hamlets (Q83187836), Helene Aldwinckle blue plaque (Q116544313)). One building, Colonnade Hotel (Q5148462) "has part" blue plaque, which commemorates Alan Turing.

Would there be less redundancy if the person recognised by the plaque had a statement saying something like "commemorated by / award received > blue plaque" and then qualifiers for date, awarding body, and coordinate locations? Or is the separate item preferable because of the material and geographical nature of plaques? I'm thinking probably the building approach is not ideal because most buildings home to plaques will not be on Wikidata already and so that would be a barrier.

What do you think? Zeromonk (talk) 09:42, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

I don't think we should compete with the good people at Open Plaques (Q23018437), and should use Open Plaques plaque ID (P1893) rather than create lots of new items Vicarage (talk) 14:27, 13 August 2024 (UTC)
I agree with Vicarage. Multichill (talk) 16:32, 13 August 2024 (UTC)
Thanks both, that makes total sense! Do you know if it's possible to write a query in the Wikidata Query service to pull in things like coordinates from OpenPlaques to represent alongside data about people? Zeromonk (talk) 09:38, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
I don't, but you might also like to look at Historical Marker Database (Q21815238) which also has a WD property. Generally WDQS returns WD information, and you'd need to scrape URLs mentioned there to get further information on the 3rd party site. Vicarage (talk) 15:55, 15 August 2024 (UTC)

P248

Why stated in (P248) is vague and we dont have properties for different types of resources, like book, article, database etc.? Juandev (talk) 07:15, 14 August 2024 (UTC)

We want to be wary of multiplying up properties, as it generates more edge conditions and slows queries. As with described by source (P1343), its better to have a vague general property and use qualifiers to narrow it down. Vicarage (talk) 07:46, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
@Juandev Please don't create items like Q128840843 for each URL you want to cite in a reference. It is perfectly adequate to just cite it using a more general stated in (P248) value such as Vetřelci a volavky (Q98538810) and specify URL or authors using reference URL (P854) and author name string (P2093) *in the reference itself*. See Help:Sources#Web_page for a general quideline. Vojtěch Dostál (talk) 11:08, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Creating items for chapters such as Q128836594 is also unnecessary, see Help:Sources#Books where usage of chapter (P792) is explained. Vojtěch Dostál (talk) 11:10, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
type of reference (P3865) may be useful, too. --Matěj Suchánek (talk) 12:46, 17 August 2024 (UTC)

What to do when external identifier URL form is changed?

Hello, as the title mentioned, I observed that the URL format for PDDikti higher education institution ID (P9959) (attribute for Indonesian higher education institutions database) is changed, the attribute currently list the URL format as https://pddikti.kemdikbud.go.id/data_pt/$1 where the current version used by the PDDIKTI system is https://pddikti.kemdikbud.go.id/detail-pt/$1

This make the value contained in the attribute obsolete as it did not return the supposed data. What should I do to resolve this? Do I need to contact property creators to update or could I myself update it? I saw some folks from Indonesia tried to update the pattern, but they said it did nothing (in the end they reversed it back). Or is there some period until all the record resolved after we update the value contained in the formatter URL (P1630)?

This happened often in Indonesia, if the ministry get merged or dissolved or divided, a lot of URLs will changed. Thanks. HA (talk) 10:36, 17 August 2024 (UTC)

Hi, I changed the formatter URL property at PDDikti higher education institution ID (P9959) to match with the current URL format you mentioned above. The change will take effect in user interface after few hours time (often up to 24 hours). Until that the user interface will continue to present users the old URLs. –Samoasambia ✎ 15:17, 17 August 2024 (UTC)
Thank you very much. HA (talk) 15:33, 17 August 2024 (UTC)
Also, could you kindly also check the regex, whether they can pass the newer format? Since I noticed in the given sample in the discussion page, compared to the newer one, the newer one had more character (-_=). Thank you HA (talk) 15:38, 17 August 2024 (UTC)

Q18945598

At Leonardo Mocenigo (Q18945598) we have a conflation, anyone want to tease them apart? RAN (talk) 16:38, 17 August 2024 (UTC)

I moved the additional birth and death dates and most identifiers to a new item Leonardo Mocenigo (Q129258216); also moved one identifier to Leonardo Mocenigo (Q65346313) and one to Alvise Mocenigo (Q3613470). Peter James (talk) 19:32, 17 August 2024 (UTC)

Q7817546

Seems a mixup of multiple people. GZWDer (talk) 07:03, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

I split up most of the identifiers, and the birth/death date into Thomas Shaw (Q129262398). DoublePendulumAttractor (talk) 12:19, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

Poor description

Indigenous health in Australia (Q16150995): I think "medical condition" is a poor description for this item. It could be correct if the words "medical" and "condition" were considered separately, but right now it seems misleading, as "Indigenous health in Australia" is not an illness or disease. If you agree, can you please suggest a more appropriate description? 73.170.137.168 21:52, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

Looks like the description was due to an incorrect bot action. I changed it to "overview of health and wellbeing of Aboriginal Australians and Torres Strait Islanders". –Samoasambia ✎ 00:12, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

Should they be opposite of (P461) or inverse property (P1696) of each other? JuguangXiao (talk) 09:14, 16 August 2024 (UTC)

I don't think they have that relationship. Usually inverse properties are when tboth have a data type of a Q item and it is normally the case that the statements will link two items in both directions, like has parts and part of or child and mother/father. William Graham (talk) 02:01, 17 August 2024 (UTC)
It will sometimes be inverse but not always because of the "recommended" part - also would it be useful to add qualifiers to Q8111 statements to say who it is recommended by? When looking at how P111 was used, one of the first uses I found was Q22686#P111 where I think it is not the correct property for the purpose but I'm not sure what should replace it there. Peter James (talk) 19:39, 17 August 2024 (UTC)
Interesting spotting on Q22686. :-) P111 is of physics, not body part. JuguangXiao (talk) 08:37, 19 August 2024 (UTC)
If the same-type of Qs is the condition for inverse property (P1696), then are there other Ps between heterogenous Qs representing a sense of inverse? Or put it in another way, the 2-step round trip properties between Qs? JuguangXiao (talk) 08:47, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

Addition of a field for skin names

Hello, I am wanting to be able to better reflect Australian First Nations skin names in Wikidata, these vary between people groups, as I think it is more appropriate to do it here then in Wikipedia and it is not currently something that is well reflected.

I do understand that it is a very niche request. The 'best' fit that I can currently see is: name in native language but this does not reflect the reality of the naming system.

I am able to provide many examples of people in Wikidata with skin names; but a simple examples with the same skin name Kngwarreye are: Doris Stuart Kngwarreye (Q43375807), Kuddtji Kngwarreye Tjungarai (Q82575708), Rosie Kngwarray (Q98178643) and Emily Kngwarreye (Q453890). To complicate things these can be spelled in various ways and they can appear in any part of the name and where they appear in the name depends on the time they were recorded and the individuals preference.

Any help would be appreciated.

There is a short video here explaining skin names: https://www.sydney.edu.au/about-us/vision-and-values/our-aboriginal-and-torres-strait-islander-community/kinship-module/learning-module/skin-names.html

Aliceinthealice (talk) 02:16, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

Can you please explain why name in native language (P1559) does not fit this need? — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 13:02, 19 August 2024 (UTC)
I watched the video. If P1559 can not be made to fit, then please proceed to Property proposal to propose a new property — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 13:09, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

Wikidata weekly summary #641

Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week.
This is the Wikidata summary of the week before 2024-08-19.

Discussions

  • Open request for adminship:
  • New requests for permissions/Bot: Bot5958 1b - Task: Infer Metacritic ID (P1712) of TV series, seasons, and episodes from vertically adjacent levels.

Events

  • (Save The Date)
    • Wikidata Days Bologna - November 8 - 9, 2024. Dario Nobili Library (CNR). A conference dedicated to the Italian-speaking Wikidata community, with a focus on libraries and research.
  • Ongoing
    • Like Soccer? Did you know the Uganda Wiki Soccerthon 2024 is still running and aims to create over 300 Wikidata items on Ugandan clubs, players, coaches, leagues, associations and leagues related to Ugandan soccer.
  • In case you missed it...
    • Catch up on all the Wikimania 2024 sessions with these YouTube replays. Or check the Eventyay schedule for recordings of individual sessions linked to each item.

Press, articles, blog posts, videos

Tool of the week

  • Anvesha is a drill-down browser for any Wikibase installation (incl. Wikidata). A prominent example of it in use is the Wikidata Walkabout.

Other Noteworthy Stuff

  • Wikidata: For Developers - We have a shiny new portal for developers wanting to build applications using Wikidata's data. Visit it for inspiration with showcase examples, resources, information and support.

Newest properties and property proposals to review

You can comment on all open property proposals!

Did you know?

Development

  • QuickStatements Community Consultation, until August 31st
  • Wikibase REST API: We are continuing to improve error messages and handling.
  • Wikipedia and co: We are working on moving the Wikidata Item link out of the sidebar (phab:T66315)
  • Wikidata Query Service graph split: The WMF Search Platform team is setting up the servers for the split graphs. We hope to have them ready for use soon. We also prepared the constraints checks for this.

You can see all open tickets related to Wikidata here. If you want to help, you can also have a look at the tasks needing a volunteer.


Weekly Tasks

Shamil District

Based on this edit by @Gajge, can anyone tell if Shamil District (Q109552302) and Shamil District (Q122166490) are the really same thing and can be merged? --Matěj Suchánek (talk) 14:31, 24 August 2024 (UTC)

@Matěj Suchánek Yes they are the same and should be merged.
I used google translate and it is about the same topic. RVA2869 (talk) 16:21, 24 August 2024 (UTC)
→ ← Merged

Language and Identifiers headings

Hi everyone,

I have two questions for you.

1. I want to add another language for this data yet it is not allowing me to do it. I want to add Serbian where it would say "Nekretnine.rs je specijalizovani oglasni portal za nekrertnine iz Srbije."

2. For some reason Identifiers section has not been posted, only statements, so I am wondering how I can get that done.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Боки ✉ 14:54, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

Section Identifiers has been fixed (I am assuming) automatically Боки ✉ 08:15, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

Vojtěch Dostál duplicates dates because of “unknown” calendar

Vojtěch Dostál duplicated the date of birth on Q716769#P569 because he says “we don't know the calendar model”. The reason I'm writing here, because I notified him, and he don't understand what is my problem, he thinks that is perfectly right to do that. He even refuses to set preferred rank for one of them, despite the single-best-value constraint. Please help resolving the issue. – Bean49 (talk) 11:02, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

Help:Dates#Entry_of_exact_dates says how to enter dates where the calendar isn't specified, although in practice, I think people just use the default calendar unless the source explicitly says otherwise, because the qualifier it mentions has only been used 533 times (query). Do the references for the Gregorian date actually specify the calendar? If they do, it would make sense to mark the Gregorian date as preferred. If they don't, then the original statement was entered incorrectly, according to that page. - Nikki (talk) 06:48, 21 August 2024 (UTC)
I agree with Nikki: if the sources specify Gregorian, than the Gregorian one should be ranked as preferred; otherwise, if the source don't specify nothing, I would consider all sources as referring to Julian. This was the duplication; since no source specifies the calendar, as usual, I moved all the sources to Julian. Epìdosis 08:00, 21 August 2024 (UTC)
Hi all. I have very little knowledge about calendar use in databases, and I've started using the Julian calendar as default for pre-1582 dates quite recently based on a suggestion by another user. Perhaps this could be a good job for a bot? I mean, if all databases not specifying a calendar are probably using Julian calendar for pre-1582 dates, we could just ask a bot to change the calendar to Julian? Either by specifying 'safe' databases which are thought to use Julian calendar, or by leaving out the few exceptional databases that really converted the pre-1582 dates to Gregorian calendar. Vojtěch Dostál (talk) 08:28, 21 August 2024 (UTC)
in general there is no good rule of thumb for the choice of a calendar model. The transition from Julian to Gregorian calendar lasted until 1923. Any date in between 1582 and 1923 depends on the location of the referred event. But it also depends on the location of the historian describing something. If an Italian / German / British (1752) historian describes an event in Italy, Germany, the British Isles or Russia (cross-country wise), we have two dates involved. If the written history just mentions a date without reference to a calender model in between 1582 and 1923, it is not really possible to derive the calendar model from context in a sure way. see also en:List_of_adoption_dates_of_the_Gregorian_calendar_by_country. best --Herzi Pinki (talk) 16:54, 21 August 2024 (UTC)
Most of dates of these historic european persons are known from chronicles or church records, so the calendar valid in time and place of event is probably best choice.
This date is now copied to every newer source, usually without soolving Jilian/Gregorian. JAn Dudík (talk) 05:40, 22 August 2024 (UTC)
@Herzi Pinki Still, pre-1572 dates could be overwhelmingly Julian, right? My proposal pertained to those. Vojtěch Dostál (talk) 08:23, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

College management

i want to make a project for my college which involves all students details with the teachers. 183.87.223.114 10:23, 21 August 2024 (UTC)

Maybe https://outreachdashboard.wmflabs.org/ will help. --Herzi Pinki (talk) 17:11, 21 August 2024 (UTC)

inverse property label item: What is the purpose of most of these?

inverse property label item (Q65932995) What is the point of most of these? child (Q65933004), Q88904799, sibling of (Q105123566), married to (Q105123727), related to (Q105123647), all seem superflous. They never link to anything but one single property, why do they need to exist? Especially when the actual items for these kinships already exist as items. StarTrekker (talk) 12:11, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

They enable relateditems (Q102435390) gadget to show derived statements. I'm not sure if they have any other use. Samoasambia ✎ 12:22, 22 August 2024 (UTC)
This is a workaround; see Wikidata:Property_proposal/inverse_label. The proper solution is multilingual text datatype which does nor yet exist. GZWDer (talk) 14:41, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

Sign up for the language community meeting on August 30th, 15:00 UTC

Hi all,

The next language community meeting is scheduled in a few weeks—on August 30th at 15:00 UTC. If you're interested in joining, you can sign up on this wiki page.

This participant-driven meeting will focus on sharing language-specific updates related to various projects, discussing technical issues related to language wikis, and working together to find possible solutions. For example, in the last meeting, topics included the Language Converter, the state of language research, updates on the Incubator conversations, and technical challenges around external links not working with special characters on Bengali sites.

Do you have any ideas for topics to share technical updates or discuss challenges? Please add agenda items to the document here and reach out to ssethi(__AT__)wikimedia.org. We look forward to your participation!

MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 23:18, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

For Delete

Logo used in banner

Q123215394

Non results Solman9 (talk) 02:55, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

waiting to be deleted Estopedist1 (talk) 06:36, 19 August 2024 (UTC)
Judging from the logo and the huge banner on https://ar.wikipedia.org/ , the Arabic Wikipedia doesn't even pretend to have neutral point of view.
Looks like that got exported here as Q123207466 with over 10.000 items. I don't think Wikidata is the place to do this kind of activism. Multichill (talk) 17:05, 20 August 2024 (UTC)
I changed the English and the Russian descriptions bringing them to neutral, but I highly doubt the subject is notable for Wikidata. Ymblanter (talk) 18:10, 20 August 2024 (UTC)
Wikidata:Requests_for_deletions#Bulk_deletion_request:_Palestinian_martyrs. Multichill (talk) 18:05, 20 August 2024 (UTC)
The situation is similar to Azerbaijani martyrs (list) which I've created (based on az-sitelinks) and recently proposed for deletion. --Infovarius (talk) 06:32, 24 August 2024 (UTC)

Geografic location of sailing ships

Q1409669 is an sailing ship and moves around. How can this inherently dynamic property (P625) even be used? There are some cases where ships are permanantly fixed and can be used, but this is not one. Smiley.toerist (talk) 11:10, 24 August 2024 (UTC)

According to the corresponding wikipedia article it was used as a lightvessel (Q831515) and was semi-permanently anchored at a specific location for a period of time. I guess adding start time (P580) and end time (P582) to the coordinates would be a useful way of modelling this? M2Ys4U (talk) 11:17, 24 August 2024 (UTC)
Objects that by design travel internationally, like ships, should only use geographical properties country (P17), coordinate location (P625) and location (P276) if they are 1) preserved ships that are museums, private accommodation or spent their time berthed at one spot with occasional forays out, 2) shipwrecks. As others have said, the coordinate location (P625) for the station of a lightships should be coded with has use (P366) lightvessel (Q831515) and their cumulative time periods of active duty. shipping port (P504) can be used for active vessels that out of a particular base port, like a ferry. Vicarage (talk) 12:29, 24 August 2024 (UTC)
When the item was created and the coordinates were added, the subject was de:Feuerschiff Elbe 2, a lightvessel position. It was then merged with Atlantis (Q2869415), an item about the ship, and the original sitelink moved to a new item, Feuerschiff Elbe 2 (Q59185088). There should probably be a link between Q1409669 and Q59185088. Peter James (talk) 13:11, 24 August 2024 (UTC)
the pair item operated (P121) and operating area (P2541) are used for other lightvessels and their stations. I've added machine (Q11019) as an allowable type to item operated (P121) , and made beacon (Q7321258) a geographic location (Q2221906) to get rid of the warnings. Vicarage (talk) 13:38, 24 August 2024 (UTC)

Populated places and their industries

My interest is in using Wikidata to capture and present aspects of Scottish history. After a recent conversation about the decline of the Scottish fishing industry, I looked at the available data. Petscan gives a decent category-based list of towns [2], but the place items themselves (e.g. Eyemouth (Q1020260)) lack any data association with fishing.

Looking around, I can see some use of instance of (P31) fishing village (Q1317251) but that seems inappropriate for say Aberdeen. There is also occasional use of industry (P452) on a place (e.g. Bonon (Q2910327), but with warnings that it breaches the Subject Type Constraint, as the property is reserved for use on companies, etc.

I wonder if there is another property to capture the industries of a place? If not, should there be? Or should the use of P452 be relaxed to allow its use for populated places? It strikes me that this or some other Property can underpin a richer understanding of what forms of work activity led to a town emerging/declining: fishing, weaving, salt panning, etc. AllyD (talk) 13:02, 15 August 2024 (UTC)

I'd relax the use of industry (P452) Vicarage (talk) 05:47, 19 August 2024 (UTC)
Thanks for that response; unless someone suggests a more appropriate info structure, I will take this forward to a proposal at Property talk:P452. AllyD (talk) 07:09, 25 August 2024 (UTC)

Q116172030 = Q116171429

That is a duplicate! Carl Ha (talk) 16:12, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

Q115858229 = Q105221629

That is a duplicate! Carl Ha (talk) 17:15, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

Q98410461 = Q111034095

That is a duplicate! Carl Ha (talk) 17:42, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

Q98411001 = Q111182242

Duplicate, by the way if there is a better place to report these, please let me know :) Carl Ha (talk) 17:50, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

No need to report if they are obviously duplicates. You can merge them yourself. -- Reise Reise (talk) 17:57, 31 August 2024 (UTC)
Ah thanks for the info, I thought I need admin rights or something like that. Then I will do it by myself in the future :)! Carl Ha (talk) 18:05, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

Wikidata birthday events & microgrants

Hello all,

As a reminder, the microgrant program proposed by Wikimedia Deutschland to support Wikidata birthday events is still running. You can apply until September 1st at 23:59 UTC. You'll find all the relevant information on this page, feel free to reach out to me if you have any question or issue.

If you know Wikidata groups who may need support to organize a birthday celebration event, feel free to share this message with them!

We are also running organizers calls to answer questions about organizing events and grants. The next one is taking place on August 28th at 18:00 UTC. Feel free to join if you have questions or would like to share your event plans with other organizers.

Best, Lea Lacroix (WMDE) (talk) 07:51, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Source the item itself

Could be the source the item itself? Let me give you an example. I add the item (let say Qfoo) of a certain book version, edition or translation (Q3331189) that it was printed 10 000 times. Can I reference total produced (P1092): 10 000 by the item I am in (Qfoo)? Juandev (talk) 09:55, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

References should be outside the Wiki* system, because of the "no original work" rule means they are just collating information, not defining it. So not only is Wikidata not a valid reference, nor is English Wikipedia, though the latter rule is often abused by bots. Vicarage (talk) 10:11, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
But this is not using Wikidata as a reference - books themselves often state how many exemplars were printed, so in this case it seems fine (to me) to use stated in (P248) with the item itself Uniwah (talk) 10:17, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
I think you are right. https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Help:Sources#Books Vicarage (talk) 10:37, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
That is an interesting point. As books looks like a special case, because they include lots of standardized informations about themselves. Juandev (talk) 10:39, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Mix'n'Match

Anyone else have trouble loading https://mix-n-match.toolforge.org/#/? I'm either stuck infinitely loading a blank page or just the page being blank

Only way i have managed to access the site is by using an URL like https://mix-n-match.toolforge.org/?#/search/<insert anything here> Trade (talk) 11:18, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Even when searching and matching entries it takes a really, really long time Trade (talk) 11:24, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

"The Future of Wikidata Events" Report Now Available on Wikimedia Commons

Hello,

We are excited to announce the release of the "The Future of Wikidata Events" report, now available on Wikimedia Commons. This report provides valuable insights into the current state and future possibilities of Wikidata events.

Context and Purpose
Over the past several months, we conducted an in-depth review of Wikidata events, gathering feedback from community members, event organizers, and stakeholders. Our goal was to understand the strengths and challenges of these events and explore how they can better serve the Wikidata community moving forward.

This report is the culmination of that research. It highlights key findings, offers a comprehensive analysis of past events, and outlines potential directions for the future. While specific changes are still being determined, this report will serve as a foundation for future discussions and decisions.

Highlights of the Report

  • Objective: Investigates the range of possibilities and alternatives to the current formats, with emphasis on inclusivity, environmental sustainability, accessibility, and accommodating the varied requirements of different communities worldwide.
  • Community Feedback: Reflects a wide range of opinions and experiences from community members worldwide, ensuring a balanced and inclusive overview.
  • Strategic Opportunities: Identifies key opportunities for enhancing community support, engagement, and retention through innovative event formats.

What’s Next for Wikidata Events?

  • Adapting to Community Needs: We are committed to evolving our event formats to better meet the needs of our diverse community, including exploring both online and onsite models that foster deeper connections while maintaining broad accessibility.
  • Upcoming Changes: While we are excited about the potential changes highlighted in the report, specific changes are still being finalized. Final recommendations and any resulting changes will be communicated later this year.
  • Continuous Improvement: We will continue to seek feedback and work collaboratively with the community to ensure our events remain inclusive and impactful.

Your Feedback Matters
We encourage you to review the report and share your thoughts. Your feedback will play a crucial role in shaping the future of Wikidata events. Please don't hesitate to reach out with questions, discuss with each other, or provide general feedback regarding the report at Wikidata talk:Events#"The Future of Wikidata Events" Report Now Available on Wikimedia Commons.

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Cheers! -Mohammed Abdulai (WMDE) (talk) 12:29, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Special rules for Wikinews categories?

Hello! As I understand it, there is a general rule in Wikidata that if an item has its own category in at least 1 Wikimedia project (except Commons), then we create a separate item for the category and then we link all categories from around Wikimedia to this "category item" (example: Poland (Q36) is Poland and Category:Poland (Q1455901) is Category:Poland). However, my fellow Polish wikimedian Marek Mazurkiewicz has just pointed out to me that this rule does not apply to Wikinews. Apparently, Wikinews categories should be linked directly to the main item. Could anyone else please confirm that there is such an exception (and what are the reasons for that, if you know them?). Thank you in advance. Powerek38 (talk) 08:16, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Yes, I can confirm this. The reason is that for Wikinews a category is the basic object, they do not have an analog of a Wikipedia article (a single news is not such an analog). Ymblanter (talk) 17:55, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Wiping 賀錦麗 off the aliases in Kamala Harris (Q10853588)

Is there someone who could and would be willing to wipe 賀錦麗 off the nearly 100 remaining aliases it does not belong on on Kamala Harris (Q10853588)? Thanks. - Yupik (talk) 06:52, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Why did nobody revert the bot that added these in a single edit? Would have been much easier. Sjoerd de Bruin (talk) 08:34, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
No idea, but it wouldn't let me anymore since other people had been deleting them off individually. - Yupik (talk) 10:24, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
This may be part of the problem: Q10853588#P742 RVA2869 (talk) 08:43, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
Thanks for deleting them! - Yupik (talk) 10:25, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

SPARQL to connect any two Qs

Inspired by six degrees of separation (Q2855754), I am just wondering if there is a general SPARQL statement to connect any two entities. The key part is wildcard for Ps. Thanks

Think of Wikidata as directed graph as it is, Qs are nodes and Ps (as main properties and qualifiers) are edges. There are 2 versions :

(a) treat it as directed graph, with example : −1 (Q310395) instance of (P31) integer (Q12503) studied in (P2579) number theory (Q12479) and

(b) as Undirected graph , like between integer (Q12503) and real number (Q12916) via type of number (Q47460393)

Thanks. JuguangXiao (talk) 07:27, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

You can use RDF GAS API to query the number of steps between two items using some properties (directed or undirected), for example. However (1) RDF GAS API is a Blazegraph extension, and since WDQS will move out of Blazegraph (as it is abandonware), such feature will discontinue in some point; (2) It is not scalable for all of Wikidata items - the query example use child (P40) as undirected graph, and child (P40) is used in a little fewer than one million items, where the entire Wikidata has more than 100 million items; even with such number of items, the query often fails or timeouts so you need to try it multiple times before getting a result.--GZWDer (talk) 12:17, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Fictional location from work vs. Fictional location in work

Which one of the two descriptions is the better one to use? Trade (talk) 13:28, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Rendering of coordinate values

Hi, please have a look at [3]. The values for the two coordinate location (P625) are almost the same (+- 4 meters), but the value displayed in D/M/S format differs a lot (by ~40"N and ~20"E). The real difference is the different precision. It is strange when we add the same decimal value but get quite different values in D/M/S format. I consider this to be a flaw. --Herzi Pinki (talk) 16:44, 21 August 2024 (UTC)

That's because of the precisions. In Wikibase, the precision determines how precisely the coordinates should be displayed. Without it, it doesn't know whether a value of "1" is intended to be to the nearest degree (i.e. 1°), the nearest minute (i.e. 1° 0'), or even the nearest 0.001 seconds (i.e. 1° 0' 0.000"). A precision of 0.013482119238374° means to the nearest 48.5 seconds, approximately, so that's what it rounds it to. The result is strange because the data itself is strange.
- Nikki (talk) 05:58, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Q2842000 is missing some info

Ambazonia (Q2842000) has quite a ton of missing info. The presidents for example, need to have things identifying that they are "The President of the Interim Government". Remember, there are many factions. Also, you gotta have two new presidents in the "head of state" section; Marianta Njomia and Chris Anu.
And also, you need to add the vice presidents of the four. Dabney Yerima for Ayuk Tabe, Eric Ateh for Sako, Hariscine Abongwa for Marianta, and Rev Njini for Chris.
Since we're assuming that that page is just for the Interim Government and nobody else, there are three sites you need to put in there: "statehousebuea.org" for Sako, "federalrepublicofambazoniagov.org" for Marianta, and "ambazoniagov.org" for Chris Anu. Make it so that the link to ambagov.org leads to an archive of the page too.
People also seem to sometimes erroneously call the Interim Government's state not as the Federal Republic of Ambazonia, but as the Republic of Ambazonia. Not to be confused with the faction "Republic of Ambazonia". Gotta add that to the "also known as" part of the page.
The emblem of Ambazonia shouldn't be here too. I've read the constitution and I can provide an exerpt from it, Article 4, Section 4: "The national coat of arms shall be an escutcheon supported by two crossed fasces with the motto 'JUSTICE-UNITY-DEMORACY'. The escutcheon shall be composed of two gold stars and triangle gules, charged with the geographical outline of Ambazonia in azure and surcharged with the scales of Justice." (hold on, did copy-pasting this exerpt from the constitution break the rules?)
And guess what, Sako changed the coat of arms of the interim government at the start of 2024, and the constitution Sako made isn't even ON the web.
So since the two coat of arms of the IG haven't been uploaded to Wikicommons yet, let's just use the seals of the Interim Government.
Ambazonia also left the UNPO in 2021, it seems.
But everything else seems fine. Please try to edit the things described in this post into the Ambazonia Wikidata page. Thanks. Kxeon (talk) 13:36, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

Moved this section back to PC.

--Wüstenspringmaus talk 09:26, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Wüstenspringmaus: Wikidata operates under the Open-world assumption - "lack of knowledge does not imply falsity", or in other words, every item in Wikidata is missing info. But it's also a wiki. Editing should be done by people who are knowledgeable on the subject. Is there some reason why you are unable to add this information yourself? ArthurPSmith (talk) 17:28, 28 August 2024 (UTC) @Kxeon: sorry, I pinged the wrong person there. ArthurPSmith (talk) 17:29, 28 August 2024 (UTC)
@ArthurPSmith: Kxeon is unable to edit the item because it's semi-protected. --Wüstenspringmaus talk 19:00, 28 August 2024 (UTC)
@Wüstenspringmaus Maybe @Kxeon should edit some more (non-semi-protected pages) to become auto-confirmed.
Wikidata:Autoconfirmed users RVA2869 (talk) 16:59, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

possibly same organization

I would be very surprised if Institute for Security Studies (Q18126017) and Institute for Security Studies (Q61931531) are distinct organizations (same name, same year of inception, same web domain for their official sites) and would not be at all surprised if Institute for Security Studies (Q74432455) is also the same. I'd want to add said to be the same as (P460), but may I do that without a citation? - Jmabel (talk) 23:11, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

So the first two items have different ROR ID (P6782) values, and their entries in ROR would indicate that Q61931531 is a child organisation of Q18126017 which would make sense as the latter is described as their "head office" and the former a "regional office" on their website. So perhaps tying them together using parent organization (P749) or part of (P361) would be better than said to be the same as (P460)? M2Ys4U (talk) 01:42, 29 August 2024 (UTC)
I merged Institute for Security Studies (Q74432455) into Institute for Security Studies (Q18126017) as they are surely the same. Institute for Security Studies (Q61931531) is said to be in Kenya, so it may be related but it is definitely not the same as the South African institution, assuming that location is correct. ArthurPSmith (talk) 19:29, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Settlement population by ethnic group

I'm trying to find a good way to add the population of specific settlement (village, town, city) by ethnic group. I tested with Blagoevgrad (Q173277). I added statement ethnic group (P172), set it to Bulgarians (Q133255) and added qualifiers determination method or standard (P459) with census (Q39825), point in time (P585) with the census year & quantity (P1114) with the number of citizens from that ethnical group. What I'm concerned is if ethnic group (P172) could be a statement at all for that object and is there better way to structure this data? StanProg (talk) 15:32, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

I would use population (P1082) but with qualifiers applies to part, aspect, or form (P518) always having ethnic group (Q41710) as object and ethnic group (P172) having the particular ethnic group as object. Also each statement should have a reference to the census from which the data comes from. here is a sample statement on the same wikidata item. --Nikola Tulechki (talk) 15:49, 29 August 2024 (UTC)
That's what I would have suggested, but a different structure is used for places in North Macedonia (example: Q2862113). The ethnic group property is still used as the main statement, but since 2020 has linked to new items that are instances of ethnic group by settlement in Macedonia (Q106474968) instead of including the numbers directly in the item, although there are issues such as duplication of Macedonian cadastral municipality ID (P8542) values, and use of of (P642) (which could be improved by using located in statistical territorial entity (P8138) or located in the administrative territorial entity (P131) to link directly to the village Armatuš (Q2862113) (which should be an instance of cadastral municipality of North Macedonia (Q98497401) or whatever represents its administrative or statistical status). I don't know if there was a reason for the use of Q106474968 and could not find anything similar for other countries (although most just have population statements for different years. Peter James (talk) 16:04, 29 August 2024 (UTC)
OMG, that's bad. I can't believe they did this. It works, but it goes against Wikidata's philosophy and creates a boatload of items which have no other function than to "hold" the value. At least they didn't create a new one for each census, just for each settlement-ethnic group combination :). And I see no point whatsoever in modelling it this way, compared to the solution above. I might write to the North Macedonia Wikidata community and propose to harmonize the representation and free up several hundred thousand precious triples in the graph. --Nikola Tulechki (talk) 17:50, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

UK Parliament Image ID property

Hi. Do we have a property describing the ID as here? If not, would it be useful to use it in Commons SDC? DaxServer (talk) 19:55, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Utilizing Wikidata for Enhanced Game Development

As someone involved in game development, especially with creative games like Toca Boca, I’ve been thinking about how we can better utilize Wikidata to support and enhance our projects. Wikidata’s structured data could be incredibly valuable for game developers, particularly when it comes to organizing in-game data, tracking character relationships, or even managing large amounts of game-related content. For example, imagine using Wikidata to dynamically update in-game databases or to create more interactive and data-driven gaming experiences. This could also help in maintaining consistency across different game versions and localizations. Has anyone here explored using Wikidata in game development, or do you have any thoughts on how we could leverage its capabilities in this field? I’d love to hear about any experiences or ideas you might have. Stephan0098 (talk) 22:33, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

@Stephan0098: I'm a bit sceptical if all of that data would meet our notability policy, especially if the game is not yet published. However, the software behind Wikidata (Wikibase) is free and open for everone to use and customize. I would encourage you to have a look at that :) Samoasambia ✎ 00:58, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
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